PAGENO="0001"
SAlk! ANTOMO ALCOHOL SAFETY AC'flOlk! PROJECT
~7~(~/ Lj~ (94-32)
~ J~)~ ~
HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
INVESTIGATIONS AND REVIEW
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON
PUBLIC WORKS AND TRANSPORTATION
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
NINETY-FOURTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
AUGUST 8, 1975, AT SAN ANTONIO, TEX.
C7~2~2~
Printed for the use of the
Committee on Public Works and Transportation
0
U.S. GOVERNMENT
PAGENO="0002"
JIM WRIGHT, Texas
HAROLD T. JOHNSON, California
DAVID N. HENDERSON, North Carolina
RAY ROBERTS, Texas
JAMES J. HOWARD, New Jersey
GLENN M. ANDERSON, California
ROBERT A. ROE, New Jersey
TENO RONCALIO, Wyoming
MIKE McCORMACK, Washington
JAMES V. STANTON, Ohio
BELLA S. ABZUG, New York
JOHN B. BREAUX, Louisiana
GERRY E. STUDDS, Massachusetts
BO GINN, Georgia
DALE MILFORD, Texas
NORMAN Y. MINETA, California
KENNETH L. HOLLAND, South Carolina
ALLAN T. HOWE, Utah
ELLIOTT H. LEVITAS, Georgia
JAMES L. OBERSTAR, Minnesota
JEROME A. AMBRO, New York
HENRY J. NOWAK, New York
ROBERT W. EDGAR, Pennsylvania
MARILYN LLOYD, Tennessee
DALE MILFORD, Texas
KENNETH L. HOLLAND, South Carolina
JAMES J. HOWARD, New Jersey
TENO RONCALIO, Wyoming
NORMAN Y. MINETA, California
ELLIOTT H. LEVITAS, Georgia
JEROME A. AMBRO, New York
JAMES L. OBERSTAR, Minnesota
JOHN B. BREAUX, Louisiana
ALLAN T. HOWE, Utah
HENRY J. NOWAK, New York
ROBERT W. EDGAR, Pennsylvania
WILLIAM H. HARSHA, Ohio
JAMES C. CLEVELAND, New Hampshire
DON H. CLAUSEN, California
GENE SNYDER, Kentucky
JOHN PAUL HAMMERSCHMIDT, Arkansas
BUD SHUSTER, Pennsylvania
WILLIAM F. WALSH, New York
THAD COCHRAN, Mississippi
JAMES D. ABDNOR, South Dakota
GENE TAYLOR, Missouri
BARRY M. GOLDWATER, Ja.. California
TOM HAGEDORN, Minnesota
GARY A. MYERS, Pennsylvania
COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC WORKS AND TRANSPORTATION
ROBERT E. JONES, Alabama, Chairman
SUBCOMMITTEE ON INVESTIGATIONS AND REVIEW
JIM WRIGHT, Texas. Chairman
JAMES C. CLEVELAND. New Hampshire
DON H. CLAUSEN, California
GENE SNYDER, Kentucky
THAD COCHRAN. Mississippi
BARRY M. GOLDWATER, Ja.. California
GARY A. MYERS. Pennsylvania
(II)
PAGENO="0003"
CONTENTS
TESTIMONY
Page
Arevalo, Teodoro, chief, Misdemeanor Section, District Attorney's Office,
Bexar County, Tex 43
Billy, Myron D., medical social consultant, Texas Department of Public
Welfare, instructor, AIDE School, former executive director, Greater
San Antonio Safety Council; accompanied by Buddy M. Bradshaw, pro-
gram director, alcohol treatment program 109
Cockrell, Hon. Lila, mayor, city of San Antonio, Tex 8
Flores, Arthur A., chief evaluation specialist, Problem Drinker Evaluation
Center, San Antonio ASAP 73
Gonzalez, Hon. Henry B., a Representative in Congress from the State of
Texas 3
Hawkins, Thomas E., director of environmental impact and social sciences,
Southwest Research Institute, and evaluator, San Antonio ASAP; ac-
companied by David Canann, statistician, Southwest Research Institute 125
Kazan, Hon. Abraham Jr., a Representative in Congress from the State of
Texas 6
Langland, Kenneth L., project director, San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action
Project 18
Nail, Charles W., Jr., chief adult probation officer, Bexar County, Tex - - - 103
Peters, Emil E., chief, San Antonio Police Department; accompanied by
John Fitch, inspector, traffic division, San Antonio Police Department;
and Sgt. Jack E. Flesher, coordinator, ASAP enforcement, San Antonio
Police Department 29
Reeves, Hon. Blair, county judge, Bexar County, Tex 11
Spector, Hon. Rose, judge, Bexar County, Tex.; accompanied by Hon.
John W. Bell, judge, Bexar County, Tex 59
MATERIAL RECEIVED FOR THE RECORD
Billy, Myron D., medical social consultant, Texas Department of Public
Welfare, questionnaire 110
Bradshaw, Buddy M., director of Bexar County Mental Health Mental Re-
tardation Center's alcohol treatment program, statement 112
Fitch, John, inspector, traffic division, San Antonio Police Department,
ASAP enforcement countermeasure 30
Flores, Arthur A., chief evaluation specialist, Problem Drinker Evaluation
Center, San Antonio ASAP:
Statement 70
Questionnaire 75
Gonzalez, Hon. Henry B., a Representative in Congress from the State of
Texas: Statement 4
Hawkins, Thomas E., director, Department of Environmental Impact and
Social Sciences, Southwest Research Institute, San Antonio, Tex.,
statement 122
Langland, Kenneth F., project director, San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action
Project, statement 15
(III)
PAGENO="0004"
PAGENO="0005"
SAN ANTONIO ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT
FRIDAY, AUGUST 8, 1975
HOTJSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
SUBCOMMITTEE ON INVESTIGATIONS A~D REVIEW
OF THE COMMITTEE ON Puimic WORKS AND TRANSPORTATION,
San Antonio, Tex.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10 a.m., at the Com-
mander's room, Frost National Bank Building, San Antonio, Tex.,
Hon. Jim Wright, (subcommittee chairman) presiding.
Mr. WRIGHT. The subcommitte will come to order. Congressman
Kazen, would you and Congressman Gonzalez like to sit up here? You
are our hosts and our most famous people.
Mr. KAZEN. Well, if it is all right, we will just go over there.
Mr. WRIGHT. Just as you please. At the beginning, let me introduce
to everyone the members of the subcommittee.
This is the Subcommittee on Investigations and Review of the Pub-
lic Works and Transportation Committee of the House. The members
of the panel here today are Congressman Milford from north Texas,
from the Grand Prairie-Mid-Cities area; Congressman Elliott Levitas
from Georgia; Congressman Gary Myers from Pennsylvania.
And, of course, we are greatly honored to be in the city of our two
truly distinguished colleagues, Henry Gonzalez and Abraham Kazen,
and if for no other reason, any Member of Congress, I assure you,
would be delighted with the privilege of coming to San Antonio simply
to say on behalf of the Congress, "Thank you for having produced
and shared with us men of the character and the courage and the in-
telligence and the integrity of Mr. Gonzalez and Mr. Kazen."
Let me just briefly try to put into focus what it is that this sub-
committee has been attempting to do for the past 7 years. This is an-
other in a series of ongoing public hearings into the total subject of
highway safety.
When we stop and contemplate the fact that the traffic fatality is
the No. 1 cause of violent death in the United States, I think the im-
portance of the subject comes into focus. Each year-each year-dur-
ing the entirety of the Vietnam conflict more American lives were lost
to traffic accidents right here in this country than were lost in the en-
tirety of the decade of that tragic conflict to enemy hostilities.
Among young Americans 25 years of age and under, more lives are
taken by highway fatalities than by any other single cause-disease
or anything else.
In previous hearings we have tried to focus on some of the more ob-
vious aspect.s of highway safety. and we~ like to feel that these hearings
have been productive of beneficial results.
(1)
PAGENO="0006"
2
WTe got into the question of narrow bridges that become. death traps;
into the question of roadside abutments and fixed objects that needed
to be eliminated from highway environment; the question of confus-
ing and inadequate highway signs that led people to do the wrong thing
and the lack of uniformity in highway regulations throughout the
country.
As a result of those hearings, the 1973 Highway Safety Act came
into being and it made money avaliable for a variety of projects. One
of the most prominent was the identification of high hazard locations,
those particular areas on our highways which had caused an inordinate
number of highway fatalities, and those. are being redesigned.
Striping of highways, both in the median and on the sides, and a
variety of other innovative approaches, certainly not the. least of
which is that which we a.re going to examine here today.
Probably the most pervasive problem in the environment of high-
way safety has been the tendency of Americans to drink a.nd drive,
and no doubt it is the most difficult of all to eradicate, because we are
dealing here not with concrete nor with fixed objects nor with a design
which can be changed; we ~re cleaTing here with human behavior.
In order to put. all that. we. are trying to do in a proper focus-I
want. to ask our indulgence just for a few minutes-we have a. film
that this committee put together as a public service. It is available to
anybody w-ho wants it-for free, of course.
It is a low budget film, as you will observe. It is not a slick. Holly-
wood type. It was all done in-house, as they say. As a matter of fact~
Mr. O'Hara, who is a not.ed attorney and our committee counsel, did
a lot of the photography for the film. He went out. and shot some of
these accident scenes that you are going to see.
By knowing where it was likely for accidents to occur in wet
weather, our committee lawyer, Jack O'Hara, went out. with Ins
camera and stood there in the rain and waited for them to happen
and he got them on film.
So let us beg your indulgence for these few minutes and we will
try to put into perspective what it is that we are trying to achieve in
our total look at highway safety.
We will move away from the table here so t.hat we can see this film,
and immediately thereafter we look forward to hearing from Con-
gressman Gonzalez and Congressman Kazen and from those who
represent the San Antonio program.
[Showing of film-"The American Highway."]
Mr. WRIGHT. We want to thank you for your indulgence while we
tried to put the whole problem in some basic perspective.
We are here in San Antonio today. of course. to try to get a fix on
one of the most. per\~a5ive problems of highway accidents and that is
the drinking driver.
So intent was Congress on attempting t.o come to grips with this
pervasive problem that in 1970 we enacted a law which permits the
Secretary of Transportation, working in conjunction with the Gover-
nors of the States, to create alcohol safety programs on an experi-
mental basis throughout the United States. In the past 3 years some
$86 million has been expended upon t.his program.
One of those ASAP programs has been here in San Antonio. We are
here to find out what we can learn from your experience that can be
shared with the rest of the country-not. only your successes. hut your
PAGENO="0007"
3
failures; those things that have been found to work and those things
that have been found not to work, and any suggestions that you may
have to give this committee for improving the Federal performance in
cooperation with you at the local level.
The ranking minority member on the subcommittee is Gary Myers
of Pennsylvania. I think Mr. Myers has a brief statement that he
would like to make at this point, and then we are going to be honored
and proud and pleased to hear from our two very distinguished col-
leagues from the San Antonio area.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am delighted to be here
today in San Antonio. For me it is a return from 1961. I was here for
basic training out at Lackland, and the city is a beautiful one-I
thought it then and I think it very much so today.
I look forward to an informative hearing, one which will bring us
abreast and apprised of what you have learned. As Chairman Wright
pointed out, we are interested in your successes and failures and sug-
gestions for improvements.
I mentioned over in the news conference that as a new member of
the committee I come from a rather different background. Most recent-
ly I was a turn foreman in a steel mill in Pennsylvania, and I would
say that probably about 70 percent of my time in that job, or better,
was spent on the aspect of safety in the workplace.
~Te always recognized the fact that we were able to provide, even in
a steel mill, a much safer environment for those people who were as-
sociated with us and for ourselves than they were able to provide and
have provided for themselves outside the plant, and I was glad to see
that reference in the film-it was a little amusing-to the Air Force
base, but it is actually true. We always said to the fellows inside the
plant, "You are much safer here than you are outside."
It was always frustrating for me as a foreman to realize how un-
successful we were in assisting our colleagues in the steel mill in re-
ducing their accident rate on the highways, the accident rate of their
loved ones and family.
In my period of 19 years at that particular steel plant, I think we
had one fatality in all those years, and I would not be able to add up
the number of fatalities-I do not know them for sure, but I know
in the last year or so we have had at least four highway deaths of
workmen from that plant.
Alcohol is a considerable problem, we know, from the industrial
site, and it has got to be multiplied out on the highway.
I am hopeful that my participation here today will be one of learn-
ing and turning that learning into something that is meaningful.
I want to commend the chairman for bringing the hearings here
in an attempt to provide that information for us.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Gonzalez, we are in your hometown.
TESTIMONY OF HON. HENRY B. GONZALEZ, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS
Mr. GoNzALEz. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Let me say
at the outset that I will ask for unanimous consent that I be allowed
to submit a brief statement I have for the record and not unnecessarily
take the time on the occasion of this Investigations and Review Sub-
PAGENO="0008"
4
committee, because we are here for a specific purpose in the field, and
what I have to present, I ca.n just as easily give to you up in Wash-
ington, and I do not think I should impose on the time of others
who will not be able to go to Washington and are directly affected
by the program that the Congress has seen fit to inaugurate in this
respect.
I will say that the main purpose is to welcome you to my hometown
and to trust that you will accept every one of the invitations that I
know that you will be receiving during this day to participate in some
of the things that are occurring in San Antonio today.
I also wish to add that the chairman. Jim Wright. rides tall in the
saddle in Texas. We not only respect him. but we love him, we honor
him. He has ga.ined a tremendous stature in the Congress. He is well
on his way into the leadership ranks in the House of Representatives.
He is one of the deputy whips of t.he majority party. He is the rank-
ing member of this main committee that you represent here today.
In fact, at one time in the past he and I fo~md ourselves contending
in a statewide political race, and we both lost [laughter], but two
things came out of that race: one, that Jim was a much better orator
than I am, but I spoke better English [laughter].
Mr. WRIGHT. La~ verdad, amigo.
Mr. GONZALEZ. So, Congressmen, each and every one of you, and
Chairman Wright, thank you for coming to San Antonio.
I think you will hear from the local people involved in this pilot
type of program the things that you came here to review and to
make sure that the money that has been authorized and appropriated
by the Congress has been well spent.
We are very disturbed by the rate of traffic deaths in the city, but
we can imagine how much worse it would be if this program had not
been active in this city for the past few years.
Thank you very much for your time. and I think t.hat we should
not impose on the others who will have meaningful things to sa to
you. That is the real reason why you are here.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much.
Mr. GONzALEZ. I might say, by way of conclusion, that. our distin-
guished colleague, Mr. Kazan, who has the 23d District, has just fin-
ished completing a driving tour all the way from the Capitol into
Texas, and he will have a lot to tell you about that.
If I may be excused-
Mr. WRIGHT. Without objection, the forma.l statement that has been
prepared for submission by Congressman Gonzalez will appear in the
record in its entirety a.t this point.
Mr. GONZALEZ. Thank you very much. sir.
[The statement referred to follows:]
STATEMENT OF Hox. HENRY B. GONZALEZ, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FRo~r
THE STATE OF TEXAS
First, I want to welcome my colleagues to San Antonio, especially my friend
Jim Wright. Chairman Wright has a reputation in Washington for his wisdom,
and his capacity for work. He and I once ran as opponents in a statewide race,
and we both lost. However, we did prove two things: he is a better orator than
I am, but I speak better English.
Successful efforts in government don't usually atract much attention. and that
is the case with the project that the Subcommittee will review today. The Alco-
PAGENO="0009"
hol Safety Action Program is not well known but it is an outstandi~ng effort to
cope with one of our leading social problems-the drinking driver. The drinking
driver is among the leading causes of death in this country. Alcohol is the most
widely available of drugs, and it is the most commonly abused. It is one of the
most difficult problems in the country today to find ways of separating drunk
drivers from automobiles.
It is imperative that this be done. Tens of thousands of people die each year
because of drunk drivers; many more tens of thousands are injured-many of
them very gravely injured. Property losses from drunk driver-caused accidents,
as the Subcommittee well knows, runs into the hundreds of millions of dollars
each year.
Not only that. The problem of drunk driving is growing much worse, especially
as young people turn more and more toward alcohol, which is more and more
easily available to them. A great many youngsters who fear the consequences of
hard drugs turn to the relative safety of alcohol-they know that it's safer to
get drunk on alcohol than to risk a high from an aerosol can, or pop an unknown
combination of pills. But like drunk adults, drunk teenagers combined with auto-
mobiles are a great danger to themselves and everyone else.
Here in San Antonio, we are fortunate to have had one of the 35 alcohol
safety action programs. This program is one of only ten that is successful enough
to have been continued. In this effort, a great deal has been learned about ap-
proaches that work and approaches that don't work. You will be hearing in detail
about that as the hearing progresses.
I commend the Committee for its concern about alcohol and its abuse, and the
need to improve public safety action in this enormously complex field. Your
efforts are directly responsible for the saving of many lives in this community
and others like it, all over the nation. What you learn here today, and what we
learn as this effort continues, w-ill enable countless other lives to be saved.
We hear about the tragedies and failures. We don't often hear about the suc-
cesses. This is an opportunity to hear about a unique, successful program-a
lifesaver.
There are 9 million alcoholics in the United States-every one of them a
danger to themselves and everyone they come in contact with. No one knows
how many alcohol abusers there are in the country. I suspect that virtually
everyone who has used alcohol has at one time or another been drunk. And so
every one of these has at one time or andther been a potential danger.
There is a tremendous need for knowledge about how to prevent alcohol abuse.
It is only in preventing it that we can solve the safety problem. Right now, the
Department of Health, Education and Welfare is expanding its efforts in this
preventive approach. It is not enough to rehabilitate drunks. The only thing
that will improve the situation is to prevent the problem in the first place.
That i~s what this program is all about-not only getting drunks off the streets
and highways, but also preventing drunks from developing into a threat in the
first place.
We may have no social problem that is more pervasive than this one. It is
bound up in a nationwide complex of social values and mores; it is bound up in
the almost universal availability of cars and drinks; and it is bound up in the
general lack of understanding about the whole area of alcohol and health.
We have learned much in this program. I thank the committee for its interest
and for its pioneering effort here. I hope that w-hat is learned here will enable
you to go back to Washington with a better idea of how this program can be
improved-not only here, but everyw-here across this country. We are indebted
to you for your effort in bringing this program to us. As a resident of this com-
munity, I am grataful for those who have made this operation the success that
it is. And I want to express the hope that as this program continues, it will con-
tinue to improve and produce greater results.
I thank the committee.
Mr. WRIGHT. Congressman Kazen, it is always a pleasure for this
committee to welcome you, as we have done on many occasions in the
past when you had projects to pursue in behalf of south Texas and
San Antonio, and we are delighted to have you with us today in your
city.
PAGENO="0010"
6
TESTIMONY OF HON. AflItAHAM KAZEN, YR., A REPRESENTATIVE
IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS
Mr. KAZEX. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the coin-
mittee.
I am also pleased to join in welcoming you to San Antonio. I think
you have come to a great part of the country. I think you will agree
with us that we have many things to offer in south Texas.
I am particularly delighted to have my colleagues from outside of
the State, Mr. Levitas and Mr. Myers, and of course, Mr. Dale Mil-
ford from Dallas. We are delighted to have all of you here.
The distinguished chairman. Mr. Wright. with whom I have served
in the Texas Legislature quite a few years ago. Mr. Wri~ht. 1947. I
believe-
Mr. WRIGIrr. You and I were 8 years old then. I think. [Laughter.]
Mr. KAZEN. And I want to join my colleague in the praise that lie
has given. You have had the experience, of over 32 years in public
life as a State legislator, as a. mayor of a city, and as a. Congressman,
where you have made a. distinguished record, and you bring credit
to Texas and to the House of Representatives, and I am delighted to
be able to call you a friend.
Now-j Mr. Chairman, early in the effort to study the relationship of
alcohol to traffic safety. San Antonio was chosen as a site for special
effort. The decision was a. welcome one.
I do not want to suggest that San Antonio has a monopoly on drink-
ing drivers, but I say it has recognized its problems. Studies here by
the ASAP project staff, aided by the fine San Antonio Police Depart-
ment, produce the finding that on any Friday or Saturday night be-
tween 7 p.m. and 3 a.m. there are 8,600 drunk drivers on the streets
here, and the people who made that study stress that they do not mean
drinking drivers, Mr. Chairman they mean drunk drivers.
Because this committee created this effort to attack the menace of
alcohol on the highway. I do not have to tell s-on here that this pro-
gram begins with arrests, by officers trained to recognize the probabil-
ity that an automobile is being operated by a driver apparently under
the influence of liquor.
There follow the steps of determining what invited the officer's
attention. Was this a social drinker, who failed to recognize his own
capacity? Was it a problem drinker, a person with medical or psy-
chological problems? What help could be offered, and what kinds of
cooperation betw-een law enforcement officials in the justice system
could help avert recidivism or repeated offenses?
I am one of those Members of the Congress who believes that. some-
times we may try to do too much under the. label of good government.
I think we in Washington need to be constantly aware that there are
some areas of action that. should be left to individuals or to `local
governments or to the States. I am one of those who believe that not
all knowledge is based in Washington.
I keep in mind, Mr. Chairman, the statement of Abraham Lincoln,
who once said, "Governments should exist to do for people those things
which they cannot do for themselves."
I believe that the alcohol safety action project meets the Lincoln
standards.
PAGENO="0011"
7
None of us can control when or where a neighbor or a passing
stranger drinks, or how much. There is probably not a person here
who has not lost a relative or a friend to a traffic accident caused
when someone, unaware that drink has erased his judgment or co-
ordination or caution, crashed his car into another vehicle, or ran
down a pedestrian, or smashed into a utility pole or a bridge abut-
ment to be his own contribution to the traffic fatality statistics.
Now, this committee's legislative effort means that wa in govern-
ment are seeking a prescription for preventive medicine. The pro-
gram suggests that a drunker driver, once he is arrested, must prove
that he is to be trusted with a driver's license. He may have to go to
school or he may be required to get proper professional help before
he can get his license back.
Now, the automobile, as we saw in your film, Mr. Chairman, is a
wonderful convenience, at times. It is also a deadly weapon. Alcohol,
in excess, may make a driver forget that he is playing with a loaded
gun. He is risking his own life and those of all the innocent people
he may pass, or not pass, on the roads and streets.
I hope, Mr. Chairman, that your committee will find this program
here a useful contribution to highway safety so that it will be further
developed and that the diligent work of our San Antonio officials of
this project, of the police a.nd the courts and the Southwest Research
Institute analysts will continue to serve this area and the Nation.
And I hope that out of the testimony which you will receive here
today will come some very definite action to be worked out by local
government with the financial aid and very limited other types of
aid, from the Federal Government.
It is a local program, but we on the national level must give them
the tools with which to work, the tools that they have no other place
to get.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you, Mr. Kazen, for, as usual, a profoundly
perceptive statement. We are grateful for the cooperation that you
always have, extended to this committee in all the endeavors we have
attempted to pursue particularly for the benefit of the south Texas
area, but for the Nat.ion as a whole.
Mr. KAzEN. Mr. Chairman, let. me take advantage of the fact that
you are here and of your good offices, since you are the Committee
on Public Works
Some time while you are here-and this is a commercial-I want
to discuss with you some very pressing transportation problems
[laughter].
Mr. WRIGHT. We might have expect.ed that.. We will be available
to you, as always.
Mr. KAZEN. Thank you, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you. We are proud to have the distinguished
mayor who has attracted attention throughout the Nation and who
reflects credit and honor upon the city of San Antonio and the State of
Texas, the Honorable Lila Cockrell, mayor of the city of San Antonio.
Madam Mayor, it is a distinct pleasure for us to be in your city
and for us to have the opportunity to welcome you here to our hearing.
PAGENO="0012"
8
TESTIMONY OP HON. LILA 000KRELL, MAYOR OP THE CITY OP
SAN ANTONIO
Mayor COCKRELL. Mr. Chairman and the distiguished members of
the committee, on behalf of the citizens of San Antonio, let. me. extend
our warmest greetings to you and to express the hope that you thor-
oughly enjoy your visit to our biculturai-in fact, multicultural city,
and we want you t.o know that while you a.re here we certainly want
you to know that we take to heart the phrase, "Mi casa es su casa,"
and we want you to feel the warmth and hospitality of our city.
We know you are here on a business mission, but we hope you also
enjoy some of San Antonio's famous hospitality while you are here.
are delighted that you also are taking a. closer look and are
highlighting one of our unique federally funded projects in which
San Antonio has had a very vital participation. and that. is the alcohol
safety action project..
In 1968, the medical examiner's office produced a.n 11-year study of
fatal traffic accidents which had occurred in San Antonio a.nd its
immediate environs. It was discovered that 63 percent of all the. victims
of fatal accident.s had been drinking alcoholic beverages immediately
prior to the times of the accidents. It was also shown that 76 percent
of the drivers involved in single-car fatal accidents had been drinking.
Clearly, driving while intoxicated was a serious social issue that had
to be resolved. The alcohol safety action program. or ASAP. seems to
be a giant step toward the solution of this problem.
ASAP has brought together all of the elements of the. criminal jus-
tice system-enforcement.~ prosecution, and a clj uclication. and the novel
approach of indepth. professional. psychosocial presentence investiga-
tion, plus our local rehabilitative resources and public information and
education campaigns in one coordinated effort. to reduce the number
of alcohol-related traffic accidents that endanger our entire population.
The program elements are somewhat. typical of the many projects
designed to work with problems that are both soc.ial and criminal in
nature, such as rape and drug offenses, but ASAP has added one more
element, that. of professional. independent, evaluation of all aspects of
the project by Southwest Research Institute in order to determine
what types of countermeasure activities work best.
As a public official who must. answer to the electorate concerning the
efficiency of government spending, I am gratified to find a Federal and
municipal project that has this independent evaluation element to
msure the most effective outlay of public funds.
Also worthy of note is the outstanding level of intergovernmental
cooperation promoted by ASAP. The city of San Antonio. county of
Bexar, State of Texas, and the. Federal Government. plus semipublic
entities and agencies such as our local Bexar County Board of Trustees
for Mental Health, Mental Retardation, are all working together in a
coordinated effort to solve our driving-while-intoxicated problem.
The city of San Antonio has benefited greatly during the first 3~/2
years of the ASAP operat.ions. Our police, courts, rehabilitation per-
sonnel, as well as the general population. have become even more aware
of the dangers of DWI.
Our staff tells me that definitive, analytical w-ork is being accom-
plished in order to determine what modes w-ill best. help our citizens
PAGENO="0013"
9
who have alcohol problems. I am also told that this sort of research
takes many years in order to show definitive conclusions.
It is my hope that the ASAP program will be continued beyond the
termination date of December 31, 1976, so that it can aid in this neces-
sary research.
Perhaps if this program proves effective in dealing with DWI, the
same sort of system could be used for crimes involving drugs, sex
offenses, and other forms of antisocial behavior.
Thank you again for coming to our city, and again we stand ready
to assist in any way that we can. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mayor Cockrell, we are certainly honored to have you
welcome us and to have this statement from you about this important
subject.
I observe from your biography that you were born in the same city
in the same year that I was-1942. [Laughter.]
We are happy to have you.
You are satisfied that this has produced a beneficial effect. I know
it is hard to quantify statistically-
Mayor COCKRELL. It is a thing that is very difficult to quantify, be-
cause had the program not been in effect, we have no alternative sta-
tistics to say had we not had the program we would have lost this many
additional lives. It is something that we just do not know for sure.
We do feel that the program is moving in the right direction, that
it is certainly our hope and belief that the number of fatal accidents
has been reduced, that the whole problem of drinking while driving
and the hazards have been brought home more forcibly to the local
population, and that certainly the members of our very fine police
force have given their fullest cooperation in this effort, and I feel over-
all that the program has been effective.
Mr. WRGHT. Do other members of the panel have questions? Mr.
Myers.
Mr. MYERS. I would only ask, mayor: It is my impression that San
Antonio is committed to a long-term commitment to the problems of
alcohol and driving, just not one of being able to participate in a Fed-
eral program, and your intention in getting the program was to de-
velop a meaningful course here for a long period of time?
Mayor COCKRELL. Yes; I think we recognize the local aspects of re-
sponsibility and I think the Federal program has certainly permitted
us to have a much greater effort in resolving this problem or attempting
to resolve the problem, but I think the city itself is certainly com-
mitted to continuing its best efforts.
Mr. MYERS. Are you of the opinion that the general public of San
Antonio is aware of the program and its approach to the community?
Mayor cOGKRELL. I do not know if I could say that the majority
of people are aware of the program by its specific name, let us say, but
1 think that the effectiveness of the program in terms of bringing the
problem of driving while intoxicated to the attention of the citizens
has been effective.
I think, very honestly, we all recognize that there are a number of
governmental programs, local, State, and national, and people do not
always identify specific agencies and their program functions, but I
think in general the purpose is being accomplished.
PAGENO="0014"
10
Mr. MYERS. And one final question: Have you had any feedback
from the business community which is involved in the sale of liquor
in regards to the program?
Mayor COOKRELL. I have not been aware of any in our office. It may
be that some of our staff members may be aware, and when they testify,
you might direct that question to them.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. MILFORD. I have just one question, Madam Mayor: In taking
a look at all of the programs which we are doing now, would you have
any idea, even as a thumb-rule guess, of what a $2 million expenditure
would mean to the city of San Antonio insofar as what sort of a per-
centage of tax increase it would require-assume your city budget had
to pick up another $2 million. Do you have any idea what it would
be in the way of a tax rise?
Mayor COCKRELL. Well, our city, of course, has the same problem
that I guess every American city is facing today, and that is the great
crunch of dollars in trying to provide services in the face of inflation-
ary pressures. It would be a very great. burden to our citizens.
Our total city budget is about $120 million. It was balanced with
great difficulty-in fact, we devoted some of yesterday's council meet-
ing to the problem of balancing the budget..
We really feel that the ability of our local taxpayers is being
stretched very thin as it is now to carry out what we feel is a pretty
bare bones budget-
Mr. MILFORD. I understand that. The p~irpose of my question was
to help people-we throw around millions of dollars in figures and
the average person has a. difficult. time in seeing, well, really, what does
the addition of that cost really mean, and I find sometimes by inter-
preting these things in the basis of, well, it means another one cent of
valuation-
Mayor COCKRELL. It would mean about 8 cents on the tax rate.
Mr. MILFORD. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Levitas?
Mr. LEVITAS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Madam Mayor, first of all, let me extend my thankful appreciation
for the warm welcome and greeting we have received from you and
from the other citizens of San Antonio. You truly have a beautiful
city and a proud citizenry.
I would like, if I may, to explore the question which Congressman
Milford and Congressman Myers have alluded to.
Frequently Federal programs get started on a pilot basis which
have some benefit to a local community and then, as a result of deci-
sions made in Washington, the Federal funding of these programs is
terminated, leaving the option to the local community either to ter-
minate the program or to pick up the tab for it in the future.
Assuming that Congress were to determine that given Federal
budgetary pressures, deficits and the like, this program were not to
be extended beyond its anticipated termination date and assuming
further tha.t the city of San Antonio has found this to be a beneficial
program, is it the intention of your city government to continue this
program from local resources?
Mayor COCKRELL. I would say, I think, due to our financial limita-
tions it would be very difficult to continue it at the same level. I think
we would make every effort to try to have an ongoing program, but
PAGENO="0015"
11
the importance to us of the Federal participation cannot be
overemphasized.
We have had the same type of problem to which you allude in the
termination of some of the programs in which San Antonio has partic-
ipated under previous categorical grant programs, and I think in par-
ticular of the model cities program. We were a very major participant
in the model cities program, and I know that when that particular
effort was being phased down and phased out it was not possible for the
city to continue all of the desirable programs that had been initiated
under the model cities concept because we simply could not assume the
entire burden either locally or even with the resources in the general
revenue sharing budget, and, so, we went through what I will have to
describe as a very traumatic experience at the local level of trying to
sift through a wide range of beneficial activities and programs and
weed out, and I think-as I recall, this was about 2 years ago, and we
had about a 4-to-i ratio of projects to available dollars, and it was a
very difficult experience to weed down.
So, in a city like San Antonio, which has in general an average
income level per capita which is below the national average, and has a
municipal budget which is lower in comparison with, I would say,
nearly every other major city in our population category where we are
trying to run a very tight ship, there is a much larger dislocation by
the withdrawal of Federal funds from programs such as this as there
might be in some other city.
Mr. LEVITAS. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. Madam Mayor, thank you very much for sharing this
time with us. We know you have a very busy schedule, and we are
grateful that you have been able to be with us today.
Our next witness is the county judge and chief administrative officer
of Bexar County, Hon. Blair Reeves, who was not born in the same
city as I nor in the same year-he is a native of San Antonio, but we
can forgive him for that because he is married to a girl named Betty
Jean and I am, too, and, so, that cannot be all bad.
We are delighted to have you, sir, and glad to be in your community.
Judge Reeves is beginning his third term as county judge of Bexar
County, and we are honored to have you, sir.
TESTIMONY OP HON. BLAIR REEVES, COUNTY JUDGE,
BEXAR COUNTY
Judge REEVES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Let me first say on behalf of the people of Bexar County, let me join
with Mayor Cockrell in extending to you a cordial welcome to our
community. We are delighted that you have come down here and fa-
vored us with this visit.
I would like to say, Mr. Chairman, I know you arc from Texas and,
of course, Congressman Milford, but to our other distinguished Con-
gressmen, the county judge title in Texas is not necessarily judicial-
it can be judicial, but it is mostly administrative and is the presiding
officer of the county government, the commissioners' court in Bexar
County, and in that responsibility we have the financial responsibility
for budget setting and things of this nature in Texas.
The ASAP program when it first hit the scene in 1971, frankly,
frightened me. Ken Langland came into my office and introduced him-
PAGENO="0016"
12
self and some of his staff and some from the Federal Government and
talked about coming over to the courthouse and that our caseload on
1DWI's would increase approximately 400 percent. It was indeed
frightening because we had the financial responsibility of funding
these courts through the State of Texas-and the rest of the story is
their predictions proved true.
We at that time had three county courts at law and about-Ted
Arevalo is here from the district attorney's office and can speak par-
ticularly as to the statistics-but about 75 or 80 pe.rcent of our case-
load are drunk driving cases, so what do you do with a 400-percent
increase? It was frightening a.nd we met it, and we met it with the
assistance of the Federal dollar.
We went to the district attorney's office and increased the number
of assistant district attorneys in those courts-we doubled up on
them from one to two.
The judiciary-and you all know how independent the judiciary is,
and that is of necessity. That certainly is not criticism-but the
judiciary, in its independence, how are the.y going to take this ASAP
program and do what you all wanted, that is, the testing. referring
out to mental health and mental retardation (M.H. & M.R.) for
this drunk driving and what causes the problem. It was a problem
there, and they had to call an extra docket and they were given an extra
$2,500 stipend.
Now, mention was made, Mr. Chairman, as to the picking up of
these funds when the program terminated, and it is a real good ques-
tion because, like the city of San Antonio, the county budget is strained
considerably, and since this program has started we were required to
add two new county courts at law in Bexar County. The last legisla-
ture gave us two new courts. We have five coimty courts-we have
six county courts at law at the present time, Mr. Chairman. One has
general jurisdiction, but uses condemnation and mental health and
things of this nature and does not handle a criminal docket-but this
was of necessity to meet the caseload to a great extent because of the
drunken driver situation.
We did locally pick up the funds of the extra district attorney; we
did locally pick up the judge's stipend-I will tell you that-of $2,500
a year; and we have also picked up the testing of the M.H. & M.R. as
our local case contribution of the testing of the drunken driver.
The first 3 years of the program caused certain problems. I have
mentioned the independence of the judiciary. Quite often the person
you folks wanted to take care of, that person who had been drunk two
or three times and was back in that county court at law-and, actually
two times conviction of a DWI in Texas is a. felony and not a mis-
demeanor, but we were handling them as misdemeanors-that is the
type of person quite often the judge wants to give some time to and
does not want to put as a condition of his probation that he attend
school or that he attend these courses, and, of course, this is what was
encouraged and what we ended up doing.
I am very happy to say that at the end of the 3-year program-
and I knew when our new county court judges came in-and. in-
cidentally, all of the county court judges that started out 3 years ago~
none of them are there; two of them have retired-well. they were of
an advanced age and then they were beaten by their successors in an
election-our judges are elected in Texas-and one has gone to a dis-
PAGENO="0017"
13
trict bench. Five of our county courts at law all subscribe to the ASAP
program and they are more or less cooperating with it, but, you know,
with the independence of the judiciary, sometimes they do not refer
a person to the school that perhaps we would want them to-there
is selectivity, because testing was extremely important.
After we had done this 3 years' work, how effective was it? Our
caseload was up 400 percent, but what were we doing with the drunk
driver who was a problem driver, who kept driving, and how was he
helped? How did we evaluate him, and how was our program work-
ing?
There has to be selectivity, and to get the judiciary to cooperate in
that takes some doing, but they are cooperating, and I believe at the
end of our program we will be able to define with a more definitive
basis really what our program is doing.
Some guy must take the test and some person does not come under
the M.H. & M.R. program, and I think that we are really going to
see something in 2 years, hopefully, when the program is completed.
And I hope that it will continue and I hope that you all will continue
to help finance it, because we are contributing from our local funds
as you have required us to do.
We have that much of the program and it is not an inconsenquential
sum when you add to the courts which cost-I know Bexar County-
a minimum of $100,000 per court.
And, incidentally, representing the indigent defendant cost Bexar
County approximately $400,000 per year, Mr. Chairman, and, inci-
dentally, I just got these figures-county courts at law one through five
for this year-as of July 30 of this year, we have spent $70,320 through
July 30, 1975, on representing indigent defendants.
Now, all of those are not on our driving-while-intoxicated cases,
Mr. Chairman, but I dare say 80 percent of them are-that was a
guesstimate that the county auditor's office gave me yesterday after-
noon.
We like the program. I understand that we have 40,000 alcoholics
driving automobiles in Bexar County-the figure that has been given
to us-and we need to answer the problem.
`Mr. WRIGHT. You mentioned earlier that at the onset of the program
some of the judges were somewhat reluctant to make attendance at
the courses and the schools a condition of probation. Have you dis-
cerned a change in that attitude on the part of the judiciary?
Judge REEVES. Definitely, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. You would deduce from that, then, that the judges have
probably come to recognize a value in the requirement that the driving-
while-intoxicated driver be required to attend some of these thera-
peutic and rehabilitative services?
Judge REEVES. I think our judiciary-and I reiterate, our five-county
court at law judges realize by studying the record-they are consci-
entious and dedicated people-that in the past it has not worked. They
can look at what we call the rap sheet and see that he has been han-
dled by our police department time and time again and he is still
coming back in, and the judicial system needs some assistance and
probably in this area is where we are going to get some of the answers.
Mr. WRIGHT. We will hear from some of those judges later today.
66-089 0 - 76 - 2
PAGENO="0018"
14
Do you feel that the Federal agency has been too restrictive and
too specific in its requirements? Do you think it has not allowed suffi-
cient flexibility for local determination in individual cases?
Judge REEVES. Not really, Mr. Chairman, because, ~OU know, there
is so much judicial discretion with that court and you have required
the evaluation-we understand why you require the evaluation, be-
cause we will not know what we are doing until we do it, but to tell
that defendant standing before the bench, "You are going to go to
the school and you are going to be tested and you are going to be
rehabilitated, and hopefully it will take care of your drinking prob-
lem," and, "You are not," because you must make a determination-
now, the judiciary has handled it pretty well in this instance.
So far we have had a pretty good mixture. of people who do not want
to go, so the ones that want-"As a condition of your probation, I am
going to put you in this school," and more or less get t.acit approval of
the individual if not a condition of his probation. It has worked out
better than I thought it was going to work out.
They were really concerned over that part of the program and knew
it was one of your conditions.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Myers?
Mr. MYERS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Judge, thank you very much for your statement. Referring to your
statement and the alarm that you expressed about a 400-percent in-
crease in caseload-I would interpret that to mean that law officials
and county officials or government officials throughout the United
States probably would be able to on their own without Federal assist-
ance if they just had the money to bring to court and bring to justice
many more DWI offenders. Is it your assessment that essentially law
enforcement agencies are forced to not pursue what might be very
obvious alcohol problems because they do not have the money?
Judge REEVES. I do not think they are knowingly letting people go,
but I think what they did, they just did not. have the personnel to get
out there in the field to make the arrest-and that. group of people that
were trained just to pick up that DWTI, which was how you all framed
it-my alarm was twofold: First, as an administrative officer, what
was this going to do to our dockets? We knew we were going to have
to go to the legislature for more courts-where were we going to put
them and how much was it going to cost?
Second, I was alarmed at the feeling that we had failed in our job
to that extent, where it would be that type of an increase. You like
to think you are doing a good job, you know.
Mr. MYERS. You know that there are a lot more cases out. there if
you can just get to them?
Judge REEVES. Yes.
Mr. MYERS. With other alternatives. Do you have a. feel for any
results-you mentioned the fact that a number of the cases that would
be coming up would be ones which had been repetitive cases prior to
this time. Do you have any feel for the results of the program on these
previously repetitive cases?
Judge REEVES. Congressman, I really do not, and this is why we feel
that the ev-alution has really not-we could not effectively evaluate
until we got selective. I could not tell you how effective it wa~s until the
way we are work1ng it at. the present. time.
PAGENO="0019"
15
Mr. WRIGHT. Someone-if the gentleman would yield-might want
to make a synopsis of how many of these people that had been repeaters
have not begun to show up again on the docket.
Judge REEVES. Come back into the system? Yes, sir. I cannot give
you that answer, but I think the information can be furnished.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. We riTtight derive some of that information from Mr.
Hawkins at a later point today. Mr. Milford, do you have any
questions?
Mr. MILFORD. No questions.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Levitas?
Mr. LEVITAS. No questions.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much, Judge Reeves. We appreciate
very much your being with us.
Judges REEVES. Thank you all for being here.
Mr. WRIGHT. I believe our next witness is Mr. Kenneth F. Langland,
the project director of the San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action project.
Is Mr. Donahue here? We had wanted to recognize Mr. Donahue. He
was planning to be with us-the director of the department of human
resources and services for the city of San Antonio. If he arrives, some-
body perhaps can tell us so that we can recognize him.
At this time, Mr. Langland, we will be pleased to hear from you,
sir. Your prepared statement in its entirety will appear at this poini
in the record.
[Statement referred to follows :~
STATEMENT OF KENNETH F. LANGLAND, PROJECT DIRECTOR, SAN ANToNIo
ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT
Mr. Chairman and Members of the Committee: Thank YOU for the opportunity
to submit a statement concerning the San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action Project.
I am the Project Director and have served in that capacity since the beginning
of the project in early 1971. Prior to my employment with the City, I served
thirty one years with the Federal Government, of whicli twenty-five years was
in the field of transportation. My statement will not involve any specifics on
project evaluation, as Mr. Tom Hawkins, our project evaluator, will be appearing
before you with that information.
The organization of the Alcohol Safety Action Project (or ASAP) had its
beginning with the appointment of the Project Director in March of 1971. During
the remainder of the year 1971 it became the task of the Project Director to
organize a number of countermeasures into a workable system; to write a
proposal of what was planned or the operationalperiod 1972, 1973 and 1974; and,
following the acceptance of the proposal by National Highway Traffic Safety
Administration, to assemble a staff and prepare a detailed plan of operations as
approved in the proposal. It should be noted here that no one had ever heard of
an ASAP nor were there any technicians or professionals with any experience in
the area of alcohol and traffic safety. All we had to go on was a concept given
to us by NHTSA.
In organizing the countermeasures that were to participate-Enforcement,
Prosecution, Adjudication, Probation, Rehabilitation (Alcohol Information and
Driver Education School, Alcoholic Treatment), and Public Information and
Education-no major problems were encountered with the exception of the
County Courts and Probation. Two of the County Judges had been on the bench
for many years. Neither of these elderly gentlemen would commit himself to
any participation in the project. This posed a dilemma, as the participation of
the courts was essential to final approval o the project by NHTSA, as well as
being the key to the operation of ASAP. Rehabilitation options could serve no
useful purpose if the courts were not inclined to use them. At this point in
time the assistance of the Bexar County Chief Administrator, County Judge Blair
Reeves, was requested. A commitment was obtained from the third County Court
PAGENO="0020"
16
at Law Judge, the flonorable H.F. Garcia, who pledged his support and was
later to influence partial participation of the other two judges.
The remaining task was to enlist the support of the Probation Officer and
to engage his participation in the DWI pre-sentence function of the program.
Federal funds were initially programmed to pay for additional probation per-
sonnel to conduct pre-sentence investigations; however, after the proposal was
submitted, the Adult Probation Officer withdrew- his intention to participate in
the program, stating that he was obtaining federal funds from another source
which would not impose federal guidelines such as those included in the ASAP
proposal and the detailed plan. Because of this decision on the part of the proba-
tion office, ASAP felt obliged to organize its own DWI pre-sentence investigation
activity, later to be known as the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center. The
function of this activity, briefly described, is the psycho-social evaluation of
DWIs referred by the courts to determine if the offender had a drinking problem
and to advise the courts by written report of this problem as well as recommended
rehabilitation.
By October 1971 the ASAP staff wr~s assembled and sub-contracts were
negotiated with various agencies which w-ould assist in or conduct certain
countermeasure operations. These were Southw-est Research Institute for Project
Evaluation; the University of Texas Medical School at San Antonio for pro-sen-
tence investigation; the Greater San Antonio Safety Council for conduct of
the DWI School (Alcohol Information and Driver Education School) ; and the
Texas Safety Association for public information services. Assistance by way of
ASAP Federal funds was given to the treatment program for data and to county
prosecution and the courts for personnel requirements.
It is necessary at this point to digress for clarity with respect to City and
County functions. The prime contract let by NHTSA is with the City, but many
of the countermeasures such as prosecution, adjudication, probation, and alcoholic
treatment, are Bexar County activities.
Attached as enclosure 1 is the initial organization of the ASAP system at the
time operations commenced in January of 1972. The advisory committee shown
on the chart functioned for a period of six months and was thereafter discon-
tinued. The problem with the Advisory Committee was its size, too large, and
the turnout became successively smaller and smaller during the first year. The
core control group consisted of officials in charge of each countermeasure and
has continued to function.
During the operational period all of the countermeasures within the system
functioned as planned, although administrative procedures were continually
being modified to conform to trial and error experience. Difficulties encountered
involved the courts and the probation office. As previously explained, two of the
three county courts were not participating sufficiently, w-hich made it impossible
to obtain a good evaluation of the judicial and rehabilitation countermeasures.
In an effort to bolster court referrals, a pre-trial program w-as instituted by the
District Attorney's office, which called for offenders of the social drinker category
(not problem drinkers) to attend the DWI school in consideration of a possible
reduction in the DWI charge. This pre-trial arrangement has worked well but
was started too late to have any substantial effect on the project during the first
three-year operational period.
There was a difference of opinion with the Probation Office as to prerogatives
and quality of rehabilitation services that should be provided DWIs. Tl~e position
of ASAP has always been in support of high quality education and treatment.
The rest of the countermeasures: enforcement, prosecution, rehabilitation
(DWI school and treatment), and public information and education, performed
well during what was to become Phase 1. The workload leveled out at around
5,500 DWI arrests per year, which in turn had to be filed on and prosecuted by
the District Attorney. Rehabilitation, education and treatment could easily have
handled a heavier work load had the courts referred 90 to 100 percent of pro-
bationers as opposed to approximately 35 percent.
As the first phase of operations came to a close, we were convinced that our
organization was sound and effective, providing we had complete support of the
courts. Support of the Probation Office was desirable but not essential, if we had
support of the courts. During 1974 two more courts w-ere authorized, which w-ould
provide five county criminal courts effective January 1, 1975. In addition, an
entire new slate of judges was elected. Thus all the ingredients were present for
an ideal program when NHTSA invited San Antonio to submit a proposal for a
two-year extension last October 1974, which was subsequently approved.
PAGENO="0021"
17
The first seven months of operations in 1975, which started Phase 2 of ASAP,
have progressed smoothly and, as previously mentioned, the project has the
support of the courts, particularly with regards to the Problem Drinker Evalua-
tion Center, the DWI school, and the Alcoholic Treatment Program. Unfortu-
nately, there has been no change in our relationship with the Probation Officer, in
spite of numerous approaches by the ASAP staff and discussions with NHTSA
officials requested by the Probation Officer.
In Phase 2 the ASAP organization was modified to provide for a smaller ASAP
management staff and to increase the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center staff,
which has permitted the assignment of an ASAP Evaluation Specialist to each
court for specialized assistance. Sub-contractual arrangements with the Univer-
sity of Texas Medical School at San Antonio and the Texas Safety Association
were discontinued, as was monetary assistance to prosecution, adjudication and
treatment. A new sub-contract was arranged with a local advertising agency to
complement DWI enforcement activities.
`The two year extension plan of operations includes innovations in ASAP
enforcement patrol and evaluation design in the rehabilitation area. Briefly,
the enforcement plan provides for a show of force on specific areas of the freeway
system and two designated areas off the freeways. The evaluation design in the
rehabilitation area provides for follow-up interviews of DWIs who have com-
pleted rehabilitation to determine if any chaiige has occurred in their life style
patterns. These interviews also include DWIs who have not undertaken rehabili-
tation. Comparisons between the two groups will be made to measure the
effectiveness of rehabilitation.
In summary, the following conclusions are offered:
There is a need for an ASAP-type system in Bexar County based oii the number
of alcoholics in the county; the number of drunk drivers determined by roadside
surveys; and the proven ASAP approach to place potential alcoholics in appro-
priate rehabilitation agencies.
All County Court at Law judges agree with the ASAP long-range concept of
rehabilitation for those to whom the criteria apply.
Continued federal funding is essential until specific courses of action are
identified which are effective in reducing alcohol related accidents. During this
period steps should be taken to integrate successful countermeasures into the
City and County structure and to place the financial burden squarely on the
shoulders of the DWI offender by assessing stiffer fines.
All federal, state and local funding should be concentrated in a single highly
professional alcoholic treatment agency instead of parceling funds out to a
multitude of smaller, less professional activities. This super-abundance of smaller
agencies has a tendency to promote the structuring and longevity of staff workers
with questionable ability at the expense of high quality professional treatment.
Education on drinking and driving needs to be incorporated in our secondary
school system.
A limited public information and education effort is essential to continue public
awareness of the problem and to review and update education.
The Problem Drinker Evaluation Center as currently constituted is an essential
service to the courts and eventually should be incorporated into the County
Court structure.
The use of a contract between NHTSA and the City which included a detailed
statement of work as well as the provision for a Contract Technical Manager,
Mr. James ID. Hill, located at NHTSA Region VI, Fort Worth, proved to be good
business. Mr. Hill wa's extremely effective in his relationship with ASAP. The
detailed plan protected both the City and NHTSA in that it precluded any
changes in the agreement without the approval of both parties and provided
for exact delineation of methods and responsibilities.
A close relationship between concerned state agencies such as the Governor's
Office of Traffic Safety, and ASAP is very important in order to promote and
coordinate necessary legislation and funding toward an effective system of
dealing with alcohol abuses. This would allow the expertise of all areas of
government to work together towards the establishment of productive, efficient
systems without impotent redundancies.
In closing, let me express my confidence in ASAP's mission. I feel that our
San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action Project is materially assisting in the improve-
ment not only of the traffic safety system and the criminal justice system, but also
is assisting social rehabilitation agencies to reach more clients with the help so
badly needed.
Thank you very much.
PAGENO="0022"
18
SAN ANTONIO ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROOECT
Control
--Coordinotion
* rav:alS:eusticieol
~ c Information Scsci-~ ist
TESTIMONY OF KENNETH L. LANGLAND, PROJECT DIRECTOR, SAN
AI~TONIO ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT
Mr. LANGLAND. Mr. Chairman. members of the committee., you
have my rather lengthy, detailed statement. to the committee; and it
is my intention here to stress the highlights of the statement- that I
submitted.
First of all, I am going to cover some of the historical aspects and
touch generally on the first 3 years of our operations. I will also
touch on some changes that we have made with the 2-year extension
that we now have and what has happened so far during the 7 months.
I have a list of conclusions that I would like to read to the committee,
my observations of problems that we have encountered throughout
our program here. I would like to make note at this time of what
differences we have with certain agencies, that they have simply been
differences in viewpoint and certainly not any personal anxiety as
far as I am concerned or on the part of my staff.
Now, as you mentioned, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Hawkins is our evaluator
and we look to him for statistics, what proof that we have for successes
PNO.1[TC OFFICE RELATIO~:FLIPS
San Antooio
City Meneger
~sory~
Committee
I -J
I
/
Couotsrmeasures
Lao! Enforcs~or;
-sychoscc~ai uVa!u5t1On~:
Alcoholic Treatment
District Attor~ey
County Courts
Public Ir-fomnation and
Education
Alcohol Information and
Driver Edicotion School
Project Evaluation
PAGENO="0023"
19
and failures and this sort of thing, so I will not get into his field at all
and allow him full time in his specialty.
The alcohol safety action project, as Judge Reeves mentioned,
started back in March of 1971. As a matter of fact, I think my first
day of duty was meeting Judge Reeves, and I want to point out right
now that Judge Reeves has been not only our ASAP friend, but my
good friend, and he has given me much guidance when I definitely
r~eeded that.
I would like to point out that I have not been involved in local
community government. I did not know anything about it. I spent 31
years of my time with the Federal Government. I am a retired Army
colonel. I have had considerable experience in education. I spent 4
years at Washington-Jefferson College teaching-that is in the State
of Pennsylvania, of which the good Congressman Myers is quite aware.
Iwas the dean of the Transportation School at Fort Eustis, Va.,
and have done considerable graduate work in the field of transporta-
tion.
The problem of starting a program here about which nobody knew
anytLing was interesting, to say the least. I found that I did have the
cooperation of the local county and city officials; I got the support that
I needed, but then, again, we were working off of a Federal concept-
simply a concept, and that it was my job to draw in the local activities
such as enforcement-I might say when we talk about enforcement, we
are talking about the San Antonio Police Department, and added to
that we have the Department of Public Safety, which is our State
patrol in the State of Texas, and we have our sheriff's office and we
have what we refer to as our "bedroom city policemen."
So all of these combine as enforcement as we look at it.
From there, of course, we move to the district attorney's office, the
judicial system, the probation office, and then, of course, our rehabili-
tation and certainly our public information and education, which al-
together make up ASAP.
I have a small staff of five people at this time and we manage the
program; we coordinate the program. I do not control those elements;
we coordinate. We have gotten together and prepared a plan of opera-
tion.
This first came out in the nature of a proposal in 1971 which was
approved by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration,
which I will refer to as NHTSA, and from there we progressed to the
preparation of a detailed plan of just how were we going to conduct a
3-year program-and when I say "a detailed plan," it certainly was
that~. It was some 600 pages in length and prepared by myself and the
counter-
Mr. WRIGHT. At that point, for our elucidation, was it required of
you that you prepare this written plan in that elaborate form or did
you choose to do this?
Mr. LANGLAND. No, sir, that was-well, we might have been a little
more prolific than some. I do not know. But we were required to pre-
pare a detailed plan, and I support that. The detailed plan which was
developed by the local community here and approved by NHTSA was
to become a part of our contract.
Mr. WRIGHT. You do not feel, then, that the requirement for the
preparation of this elaborate, detailed plan was unnecessarily burden-
some?
PAGENO="0024"
20
Mr. LANGLAND. No, sir, I do not-
Mr. WRIGHT. Do you think it was helpful?
Mr. LANGLAND. I think it was good business. So, briefly, that is
what we had to do to get these people together.
Now, what were the problems? Judge Reeves alluded to two elderly
judges that sat here at that time, and these, incidentally, were the first
contacts I had in the courts system, and, frankly, I did not. make any
headway at all with either of these fellows. They had been on the
bench a long time and I guess they looked at me as sort of a junior so-
and-so that should not be around telling them how to run their busi-
ness-and I agree with that. Had I been on the bench as long as they
were, I might have resented it too.
But, anyway, I was just not getting anyplace, and I knew that with-
out the cooperation of the courts, we just would not have any program.
Our rehabilitation activities would be going unused.
So here, again-and I hate to keep bringing Judge Reeves up, but
I had to have somebody to turn to, and he was it. So I went to him with
the problem and we w-heeled him up the stairs to the second floor and
we talked to the Honorable Judge H. F. Garcia. and we got. a. gem on
this one. He was 100 percent behind our program and he even got. the
other judges to participate from a partial standpoint. So we were able
to get going at that time.
Now, we wanted to bring the probation office into our program.
However, here was some consternation, as I recall, on the part. of the
probation officer as to getting involved in Federal guidelines when pos-
sibly he might not have to. That is about as far as I can go with the
thing. It was a difference iii viewpoint on his part.
So what happened here. We had to come up with some kind of a
presentence investigation thing and we felt obliged to try it. on our
own, and we had the funds to contract with the University of Texas
Medical School and we engaged the services of two psychiatrists and
a Ph. D. psychologist., and then I brought into this presentence in-
vestigation organization, which we refer to, incidentally, as t.he Prob-
lem Drinker Evaluation Center at this time-we brought in a young
fellow by the name of Art Flores-and you will hear from Art later.
Art underwent sort of an internship for 3 yea.rs with these psychia-
trists and psychologists, and I think it is an understatement to say
that he tests problem drinkers. It is a very indepth, psychosocio kind
of interview where he tries to draw out. the problems that. are bugging
this guy, and I feel that this is probably the. biggest thing that. we
have come up with so far. Perhaps our difference with the views of
the probation officer, possibly he did us a. favor because we have really
got, I think, a real going kind of thing that. the county desperately
needs. You have got to ta.lk to these people if you are going to find
out what is bugging them; you cannot give them a. 10-question written
examination and-
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Flores conducts ind.epth interviews with each of
these people?
Mr. LANGLAND. Yes, sir. He has a staff of three other psychologists-
incidentally, all practicing psychologists.
Mr. `WRIGHT. How many such people has this st.aff interviewed in
the past 3 years?
PAGENO="0025"
21
Mr. LANGLAND. Oh, in the past 3 years, I would have to say over
2,000.
Mr. WRIGHT. So, they have taken the time to sit down patiently and
on an individual basis with that many individual DWI people and
go into their personal problems and try to get to the root of what is
bothering them that makes them drink and drive?
Mr. LANGLAND. That is right. Anyway, I call that the birth of our
problem drinker evaluation center. I am quite proud of it. I think it
is something that the community can continue, and I will get into some
of my ideas a little later.
I might add that we have a number of subcontracts that we utilized
during the first 3 years of our operation. One of them I mentioned,
the University of Texas Medical School.
Southwest Research is under contract-was then and still are-to
conduct our project evaluation.
We had a contract with Texas Safety Association involving public
information and education at that time. Texas Safety Association is
located in Austin.
We had a contract with the San Antonio Safety Council, which
operates our DWI school, which we refer to as AIDE, alcohol infor-
mation and driver education.
We had `a data collection contract with an alcohol treatment pro-
gram here, a small contract, and then we did provide funds, `as the
judge mentioned here, for the prosecution and the couxity courts-
Mr. WRIGHT. As I understand it, Mr. Langland, you are running
on two tracks basically-does the committee understand this correctly?
The typical person convicted of `a DWI charge is sent to the AIDE
school or `as a condition of his probation is required to attend this
series of courses, and those are conducted at night or on weekends
so that it does not interfere with his work.
But then do I understand that in addition to that, another type of
service is performed for the more serious problem drinker, the con-
firmed problem drinker-
Mr. LANGLAND. You are right, sir. The Problem Drinker Evaluation
Center will normally-and this is in a simple form-categorize an
individual as being a social drinker or a problem drinker.
Mr. WRIGHT. The social drinker goes to the AIDE school?
Mr. LANGLAND. The AIDE school.
Mr. WRIGHT. Now, what happens to the problem drinker?
Mr. LANGLAND. The problem drinker, depending on the diagnosis,
may be referred to a number of-or one of several treatment agencies.
Routinely, he will go to the alcoholic treatment program which is part
of the mental health and mental retardation program here in Bexar
County.
They have good professional people, psychiatrists, counselors, and
this sort of thing.
Or if it is a simple case of poverty-the individual understands no
English-he may be referred to a local community action program
we have called CARP. If there is an inclination that maybe he might
fit into the buddy system of Alcoholics Anonymous, he might be
referred there.
Or if it is an inpatient requirement, he might be referred to the
veterans' hospital or he might be referred to our State hospital.
PAGENO="0026"
22
All of these things are taken into consideration at this evaluation
center, and that is why I think it is so important and a big part of our
program.
Now, I am not sure that-
Mr. LEVITAS. Would the Chairman yield at that point?
Mr. WRIGHT. Surely.
Mr. LEVITAS. Because Mr. Langland is talking about the problem
drinker evaluation center, and I am not familiar with your judicial
pr~esses here in Texas, but I gather that upon conviction there is
generally an adult probation investigation made prior to sentencing
as a routine matter, and this problem drinker evaluation center seems
to me, just as an outsider, to be within what would normally be the
ambit of an adult probation investigation, and yet it appears to be
divorced from that.
Should it properly be under the regular adult probation system for
presentence investigation and, if not, why has it been separated out?
Mr. LANGLAND. I will answer your question this way: In its present
form, and as it is now organized and staffed, I believe in the long run
it should be in the probation, but in any other form I could not sub-
scribe to it. Now, these are my views, and I could-well, I was never
able to obtain any assurance that this kind of a program-evalution
program-would be continued and, therefore. we felt it best to keep it
separate as it is now.
Mr. LEVITAS. Now, when you say you could not get any assurance
that it would be continued in the form in which it has been structured
under the auspices of your program, was the lack of assurances in-
volving a Mr. Charles W. Nail? Was that the person~
Mr. LANGLAND. These were discussions that I had with the adult
probation officer, yes, sir.
Mr. LEVITAS. And it was the lack of assurances from Mr. Nail that
caused you to feel that the program had to be set imp independently
of the adult probation function in Bexar County?
Mr. LANGLAND. Now, this is the second goal, I must remind the
committee. Initially it was his view that he did not want to participate
in the program, which was his prerogative.
Mr. LEvITA5. Well, the reason that I pursue this, Mr. Langland-
so that you do not misunderstand me-just the little bit I have heard
up to this point and in the testimony I have read, the prepa.red state-
ments, it appears to me that normally this function would be per-
formed under the auspices of an adult probation presentencing hives-
tigation evaluation and the like. For reasons you have st.ated. you feel
it is best to have kept it separate, although optiniiimly it should be back
under adult probation if it were operating in the form in which it
has now been structured, and since it is a duplicative function, I just
wanted to get the record straight.
Mr. LANGLAND. I should point out here that true probation, in my
Opinion, involves many things that I don't believe the probation officer
in San Antonio or in Dallas-I do not even think you have misde-
meanor probation in Dallas-but they are just not funded; they are
unable to-well, they can just about carry the load that they now have
at the present time. Now, they have a side to the story, too.
When you consider the fact that some 2,000 DWI's are on proba-
tion at any given time, this is a prett~ big load for them to handle.
PAGENO="0027"
23
especially when you consider the fact that the probation officer has
been designed primarily for felonies.
Mr. LEVITAS. Thank you, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, ideally, for the program to work at its maximum
effectiveness, you have to be pretty well on the same wavelength, do
you not?
Mr. LANGLAND. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. The person in your position and the probation officer.
They need to be working in harmony toward the same goal.
Mr. LANGLAND. Right, sir. Now, on the court input, I mentioned the
two elderly judges that we had-and here, again, I must apprise the
committee, the only people that the court can refer for treatment to our
program are those that have asked for probation and it has been
granted-which is probation. There is no other way to, shall we say,
put the clout to the guy except through probation.
So not all DWI's come into our program. They can get a final con-
viction, for example, and it usually is a jail and license suspension-
type thing and no probation involved, or if the charge is reduced to
ordinary drunk, there is no probation involved.
Nevertheless, in the first 3 years, we got rather a humdrum kind
of input out of the courts. There were times when we had people being
assigned to the school that we did not know about-assigned direct
to the school. They were not sent down through our Problem Drinker
Evaluation Center-they were sent direct to the school that should
have gone into treatment, and vice versa. So this sort of mixed up
the scientists at Southwest, so this was one of their problems.
And then, of course, we estimated that we could have had 70 per-
cent more than we were getting into the program-that was for the
first 3 years.
Mr. WRIGHT. Seventy percent more what?
Mr. LANGLAND. On probation.
Mr. WRIGHT. Offenders-
Mr. LANGLAND. Of the probation type.
Mr. WRIGHT [continuing]. To evaluate?
Mr. LANGLAND. Yes, sir. We only got about 30 percent of those
that were granted probation. And I might point out that as of the
first of January-and Judge Reeves said that the courts were behind
us-they definitely are, 100 percent. They believe in rehabilitation.
So, as far as I am concerned, we found something that I wish we
could have found 3 years ago, but we have it now.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, basically, I gather from what I have heard
thus far, in the beginning there was a communication problemS with
the courts, with the probation officer, with everybody trying to get
together. Do you feel that this communication problem has been sub-
Stant1ally alleviated now over the last few years and that everyone
is working a little more closely in harmony with one another?
Mr. LANGLAND. Oh, very definitely, sir. I might add that here with
out new courts-I mentioned our Problem Drinker Evaluation Cen-
ter, and we have four evaluators in that center, and I have assigned
an evaluator to each court to work with the judge to provide informa-
tion on alcoholic treatment, to provide education information, to pro-
vide information on any kind of interview analysis that they would
PAGENO="0028"
24
make. This is working very well-and unfortunately. I have to cover
two courts with one evaluator, but it is coming out all right.
Now, the first 7 months here under the new courts, there. is not
really very much I can ask for, except sometimes getting into the
numbers g~ame a little bit, but the cooperation has been splendid.
We would like to be a little closer to the probation officer. There is
still some differences in our views. Other than that, frankly, I iust
cannot really complain.
I might say that when we went into the phase 2 organization, one
of the first things that I did was reduce our management staff, but
then we turned around and increased our problem drinker evaluation
staff, but I do feel that on a continuing basis our management staff
can still be reduced from five possibly down to three people. And other
than that, that's the only organizational change we did make.
`We did come in with some new innovations under the new phase.
In the police department-and they will get into that in a little more
detail-we have come up with some kind of a saturation pa.troling
here we are trying on our freeways, but I do not want to steal any of
their thunder.
And then the other innovation here is one of how do we find out
what is a success and what is a failure. `What we are doing here is we
are making comparisons. `Well, how do you make comparisons? The
judge says, "This guy does not go to school; this guy does go to
school." There is the possibility of a comparison. And just how do
we compare? `We follow up on this individual for a period of 18 months
to see whether there is any changes in his lifestyle patterns as a result
of the school or no school.
In treatment, we follow up and find out has this changed this gay's
way of living; we go into a very extensive, 21/2-hour interview, and
very close, accurate records are kept. This is the second innovation that
we have gone into. Other than that, that is the only new thing that
we have instituted.
Mr. `WRIGHT. Thank you very much.
Mr. LANGLAND. I have just a little bit more. sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. We are running a little bit behind time.
Mr. LANGLAND. Could I read some of these conclusions?
Mr. WRIGHT. Surely. We are anxious to have it.
Mr. LANGLAND. There is one here that I think is quite important,
and we have talked about it considerably here.
Continued Federal funding is essential until specific courses of
action are identified which are effective in reducing alcohol-related
accidents. During this period, steps should be taken to integrate suc-
cessful countermeasures into the city and county structure., and to
place the financial burden squarely on the. shoulders of the DWI
offender by assessing stiffer fines.
I might point out that. most DWI's that. we have run through our
system are working people. They are not unemployed.
Mr. WRIGHT. Do you think fines could be made sufficient to carry
the financial load of this whole program?
Mr. LANGLAND. It could help a lot. The one expensive area that we
have here as far as the program is concerned, of course, is on the law
ellforcement, and I do not know what the answer to that. is. but these
are my views, and I am open to any questions.
PAGENO="0029"
25
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, thank you very much. Are there any questions?
Mr. MILFORD. Yes; I have a couple questions.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Milford.
Mr. MILFORD. What has been the total cost of the ASAP budget
program to date?
Mr. LANGLAND. Without Federal funds, sir?
Mr. MILFORD. Well, Federal and local, and how much of each?
Mr. LANGLAND. The expenditure for the first 3 years approximates
$2.2 million Federal funds.
Mr. MILFORD. How much local?
Mr. LANGLAND. In the local area, for the first 3 years we did not
develop those kinds of statistics, but for example, costs that were in-
volved that were not charged to the Government-the upkeep and
maintenance of all the ASAP vehicles, for example-were paid for
out of city funds.
There certainly are some funds that could be earmarked out of the
county budget with respect to the additional load on the courts over
there, although we did provide some funds, $2,500 per court for three
courts.
But I can give you some definite figures on the 2-year extension.
Now, we are getting $998,000 from the Federal Government. The city
and the county are putting up approximately $120,000 each. It comes
up to about $240,000-that is for the 2 years, the city and county,
$240,000.
And then there is a figure that we worked out on, you might say,
of about $700,000, and that includes the city and the county.
Mr. MILFORD. What would you estimate would be the continuing
cost of the ASAP program once this test period ends, an operational
program?
Mr. LANGLAND. Annual cost? I have to leave the police department
out of this, sir-well, if you want me to bring it in, I could-
Mr. MILFORD. You can submit it for the record at a later time if
you need time to get it.
Mr. LANGLAND. I would like to do that, sir.
Mr. MILFORD. All right. Fine.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
[The information referred to is as follows:]
ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT,
San Antonio, Tea.
SUBCOMMITTEE ON INVESTIGATIONS AND REVIEW,
COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC WORKS AND TRANSPORTATION,
Washillgton, D.C.
DEAR MR. CHAIRMAN: In reference to Congressman Milford's request for cost
data regarding operations of ASAP should the program be continued and funded
out of local funds, I Would envision a jointly funded (County and City) continua-
tion of the program costing in the neighborhood of $226,320 annually. These
funds would provide for $150,000 for enforcement salary costs, $66,156 for ASAP
staff salary, and $9,664 for supplies, communication, rent and travel.
The proposed continuation concept would reduce enforcement operations to
three or four nights a week and would utilize saturation patrolling on a regular
basis. We are convinced that saturation patrolling, i.e., moving the entire ASAP
enforcement into small areas of the city for short periods of time, three to four
weeks, and then moving to another area, is the answer to small budget opera-
tions.
The ASAP staff would consist of six people of which five would be mostly in-
volved with problem drinker evaluation. Project evaluation and public informa-
PAGENO="0030"
26
tion and education would be eliminated with respect to contracts and specialty
inhouse personnel.
The staff would function within the County or the City. Should it function
within the County it will be suggested that it be an adjunct of the County Court.
Should it function within the City structure it will be suggesed that it function
as a part of the City Traffic Safety Coordinator's office.
KENNETH F. LANGLAND,
Project Director.
Mr. MYERS. Mr. Chairman?
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Myers.
Mr. MYERS. Mr. Langland, I would like to go back to the planning
stages of the program, if you will bear with me.
I understand from your written testimony that there was an ad-
visory committee which has been disbanded because of some lack of
interest after it got going, but I am concerned about the figures-I be-
lieve you said that you have in the San Antonio area. 8,000 drunken
drivers-is that the figure you used?
Mr. LANGLAND. The figure 8,600 on a. Friday or Saturday night. be-
tween the hours of 7 p.m. and 3 a..m.
Mr. MYERS. So there is a considerable part of the population that is
involved here, and you are bringing to bear as a result of this program,
action on about 4,000 a year, so based on those numbers, it would take
a considerable period of time for the program to be effective even if
it is effective in preventing reoccurrences and repea.ters.
In the planning stage, was there consideration, or has there been
ongoing consideration of procedures other than relying on finding,
arresting, and processing drivers who are under t.he influence alterna-
tive to those such as use of funds from the Federal Government. or in
this program to try to prevent the drivers from getting in the c.ar~
offering free trips home, so to speak; that is, offering free. public trans-
portation as a personal choice when a person finds himself in the con-
dition of being at one place and having to get to a.nother place and
knowing he has indulged too much in a beverage?
Have there been studies to indicate whether or not IIJWI's possibly
having a set path of transportation needed from one place to another,
not necessarily needing the flexibility of a family car to get to several
places and, therefore, has need for assistance in one path after lie has
acquired too much alcohol?
This is a whole package of alternatives that I think at. least should
have been balloons up in the air for consideration before embarking
on a program which only concentrated on arresting people who got
in the automobile.
I understand there is some educational approach to this community
involved, but beyond education, has there been an attempt to use funds
directly and overtly to keep pepole under the influence out of their
cars?
Mr. LANGTJAND. Of course, we had and still have a public informa-
tion program, and we have made rather extensive use of all media here
in San Antonio on this matter of drunken driving.
Now, with respect to providing free transportation from a "ice-
house," from a ba.r, we went into this and looked into it from the stand-
point of just how we would do this. Of course, our discussions were
had with the local taxi companies here on some kind of a program,
but after discussing it with them, we did not feel that it was a feasible
kind of thing that we could handle.
PAGENO="0031"
27
Now, I know there are some other programs-ASAP programs at
other sites tried that but had no great success.
Mr. WRIGHT. We understand that other ASAP projects, Mr. Myers,
have undertaken this type of countermeasure and we intend to get
into some testimony from them as to any effectiveness they may `have
developed.
Mr. MYERS. Along that same line, have there been any attempts-
and I alluded to it when the mayor was at the table-have there been
any attempts to reach into the community and deal with those busi-
nesses which are in the business of making a profit while se]ling liquor
to attempt to get their assistance? Perhaps their assistance could be
felt in an approach to guiding people to public transportation or even
offering a subsidized ticket home, you know.
That was not explored here in this-
Mr. LANGLAND. Again, it was not explored in detail. We dealt with
the Associated Distilleries. They used to come in about every 3 months
and, as far as we knew, were sort of representing the local retail
liquor dealers, but we never really got into it in any detail, no.
Mr. MYERS. What would your opinion be when you are talking
about funding under an ASAP program? Regardless of what sort
of system you have, it is going to be expensive-I meant to ask the
mayor and I forgot to-what is the possibility of a municipality bev-
erage tax, so to speak? You see, we have a number of people who are
not being caught. Now, the proposal that the fines be made stiff enough
that they in themselves fund the program is one approach~ but cer-
tainly there are an awful lot of `people who are purchasing beverages
and escaping the eyes of the law, so to speak, on the freeways and
perhaps their contribution should be through a city beverage tax or
something like that. Was that ever discussed?
Mr. LANGLAND. No, sir, but ii am aware of this kind of program. It
has been done in some other cities. And I agree with it.
Mr. MYERS. Are you familiar, sir, with the traffic points system in
other States-and I am not sure whether Texas has it or not-whereby
certain violations do in fact assign points to drivers and they, there-
fore, are assigned to some sort of a school? Is this not somewhat similar
to the system you are talking about?
Mr. LANGLAND. I wonder if I could pass to the enforcement people
on that?
Mr. WRIGHT. Our next witnesses will be the police department wit-
nesses and maybe they will have answers to this.
Mr. MYERS. All right. Could you tell me, in San Antonio do you have
significant differences in characteristics in the city whereby some are
rural in nature and some are urban in nature and are you, through this
program, able to identify the use of alcohol being more hazardous in
either one of the geographical locations?
Mr. LANGLAND. I cannot answer that, sir. I really know nothing
about the rural aspect of it. I might pass that to Mr. Hawkins.
Mr. MYERS. Briefly, I think I know the answer to it already, but I
will ask it anyway.
Has your program addressed the problem of identifying, or attempt-
ing to identify and process users of marihuana while driving?
Mr. LANGLAND. No.
Mr. MYERS. Are there plans to do so in this program?
PAGENO="0032"
28
Mr. LANGLAND. We have no plans at this time.
Mr. MYERS. Are you aware of any detection procedure whereby you
can identify the level at which a driver is incapable of handling a car
the same as you can have a detection level with alcohol?
Mr. LANGLAND. No, sir.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you. I would suggest for the record that the
Chair is informed that the Kansas City ASAP program did include
other drugs such as marihuana a.nd we hope to get some information
for the record from them.
Mr. LANGLAND. One thing here we failed to mention: We are greatly
concerned about teenage drinking and driving and we do have a very
positive program that we are now trying to work out through our
school system here and we have a pilot program which starts this fall
in our driver education here in San Antonio and we will compare it.
with other school districts and if it is a good one. we hope to go
statewide.
Mr~ WRIGHT. Mr. Levitas, did you have any questions?
Mr. LEVITAS. Just one or two, Mr. Chairman. if I may. I think
some of the questions I wanted to ask really will pertain to sonm of
the enforcement aspects, to put it in perspective about what are the
consequences in Texas of violating the driving-under-the-influence
statutes; are there automatic loss of licenses, and things of this type?
But specifically to Mr. Langland, Mr. Chairman: From a managerial
point of view, does your program have a contract with any local
government agency here in the San Antonio area and, if so, which one
or ones?
Mr. LANGLAND. No; we do not at this time. We did during the first
*3 years. We had a contract with the county. but we do not at this
time.
Mr. LEVITAS. Your relationship for the expenditure of funds-of
Federal funds-I take it is now all within the jurisdiction of your
program and it is not given to the local jurisdiction for expenditure;
is that correct?
Mr. LANGLAND. That is correct.
Mr. WRIGHT* This program is a part of the Department of Human
Resources and Services of the City of San Antonio, so that the Federal
grant money comes to the city of San Antonio.
Mr. LANGLAND. That is right. The city is the contractor.
Mr. LEVITAS. That was my question. The city is the contracting
agent.
During the course of your earlier comments however, it appeared
that a great deal of the work that you do is with the county govern-
ment. Now, do you see for future consideration, any improvement
that could `be gained by coordinating these programs with the county
and with the city through one single unit of government or one single
agency or department rather than doing it through the separate
agencies that you are now functioning through?
Mr. LANGLAND. I am not sure I understand that. I think we are doing
that right now as ASAP, as part of the city of San Antonio. in
coordinating city and county functions-am I clear there?
Mr. LEVITAS. Yes; that is what I was wondering. And this is now a
part of the program?
PAGENO="0033"
29
Mr~ LANGLAND. Right, sir.
Mr. LEVITAS. Now in your prepared testimony you make the observa-
tion which we discussed previously about the withdrawal of the
participatioii of the adult probation on this, and then you refer to,
in describing the phase 2 operations: "Unfortunately, there has been
no change in our relationship with the probation officer."
Do you feel that on the long term this program can operate
effectively without the full cooperation of the adult probation office
in this area
Mr. LANGLAND. I think it can, sir, and the reason I say that is that,
really, the courts are the predominant group in all of this. Every-
body has to do what the courts want them to do-and I mentioned the
Problem Drinker Evaluation Center, it could very well function as a
part of the court Organization itself, but all of us have to do what the
courts dictate.
Mr. LEVITA5. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much, Mr. Langland. Your testimony
has been extremely helpful to us.
We probably should identify for the record the reference made to an
"ice house." I am told that an ice house in local parlance is a tavern,
a place where one may drink beer or other beverages.
We have three representatives of the San Antonio Police Depart-
ment whose responsibility it is to carry out this program in the en-
forcement aspects.
We are pleased to have the San Antonio police chief, Emil Peters;
Mr. John Fitch, inspector of the traffic division of the San Antonio
Police Department; and Sgt. Jack Flesher, coordinator of the ASAP
enforcement program for the San Antonio Police Department.
I wonder if the three of you might come forward together and let
us have the benefit of your experience here.
Chief Peters, if you would care to lead off, we will try to get as
much testimony and information as we can here, and following these
three witnesses, then, we will break for lunch-before you do that,
let us let the lady who has so diligently been recording this have about
a 5-minute break.
[A short recess was taken.]
Mr. WRIGHT. We will resume sitting.
Chief Peters, thank you very much for being with us. You may
proceed as you would like.
STATEMENT OF EMIL E. PETERS, CHIEF, SAN ANTONIO POLICE DE-
PARTMENT, ACCOMPANIED BY JOHN FITCH, INSPECTOR, TRAFFIC
DIVISION, SAN ANTONIO POLICE DEPARTMENT, AND SET. JACK
E. FLESHER, COORDINATOR, ASAP ENFORCEMENT, SAN ANTONIO
POLICE DEPARTMENT
Chief PETERS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is a privilege to be here.
We are pleased and we consider it a very good opportunity to meet
with you to discuss this program.
This program has been in effect during the period since I have been
chief, so I am familiar, but I would like to turn over the principal
remarks from our sector to John Fitch, who heads our traffic division.
He was very much involved in the planning stages and the program
66089 0 - 76 - 3
PAGENO="0034"
30
at our level has been under his direction consistently through this en-
tire period, and we are very highly impressed with the effects of the
program and are glad to be able to bring to you our report.
I would like to introduce Inspector John Fitch.
Mr. WRIGHT. Inspector Fitch.
Inspector FITCH. Thank you, Chief. Mr. Chairman, Congressmen.
I have submitted a narrative on the enforcement countermeasure.
I do not intend to read the whole thing, just the highlights.
Mr. WRIGHT. We will incorporate it in its totality in the record at
this point.
[Material referred to follows:]
ASAP ENFORCEMENT COUNTERMEASURE BY THE SAN ANToNIo POLICE DEPARTMENT
At the beginning of the program, the enforcement sites were selected on the
basis of severe alcohol-related accident history. This was based on an in-depth
study of all traffic accidents which had occurred during the preceding 12 months.
It was also confirmed by Road Side Surveys, that over half of the drivers in
these areas, between 1:00 A.M. and 3:00 A.M., on Friday and Saturday nights,
had been drinking and about one-fifth were driving while intoxicated.
The A.S.A.P. Program (ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT) was im-
plemented on January 1, 1972. Enforcement training-classroom instruction for
selected officers of the San Antonio Police Department in the severity of drink-
ing driver problems and in effective enforcement procedures; and, selective en-
forcement was conducted in the latter part of 1971. This training also included
extensive training in the area of probable cause. Enforcement training was con-
ducted initially in 1971 and again in 1972-1974 and March. 1975.
Enforcement patrolling was conducted every night during 1972-1914. The
result in terms of D.WT.I. arrests w-as a 318 percent increase over historical
levels for 1969-1971. This increase was due primarily to the selective enforcement
patrols; but the effect of training and using officers of the regular forces on
an overtime basis had the desired effect on the entire uniformed police force
who volunteered for the training. Detective investigators were given training
in the operation of the Model 900 Breathalyzer, and the A.S.A.P. Supervisors
were given training in the many aspects of the program.
The objective of the enforcement training was "through extensive training
in the severity of drinking driver problems and effective enforcement procedures,
to provide additional expertise necessary for a substantial increase in the rate
of detection, apprenhension, and conviction of drinking drivers."
A preliminary analysis was made to determine the effect of ASAP training
on the number of DWI arrests made by Patrol Division officers. Two distinct
training periods were analyzed, and each compared to a control group which
received no training. Three groups containing fifty officers each were selected
from the Patrol Division according to the ASAP training they had received.
Group 1 included officers who received three hours of ASAP training in March
1975; Group 2 officers had previously received the ASAP training; and Group
3 officers had never received ASAP training. The DWI arrest performance of
these groups was examined for a two month baseline period (April-May, 1975).
Preliminary analysis of the available data from the operational period, sub-
sequent to the training, indicates increased motivation stemming from the train-
ing. Comparative data are shown in the below table.
Average regular patrol DWI arrests per montl~
Period April to May:
Group 1 27. 0
Group 2 10. 5
Group 3 8. 0
This analysis is continuing. The analysis also indicates a need for inservice
refresher training for the officers in Group 2 and this will be implemented.
We have no way of knowing how many lives have been saved, how many in-
juries have been prevented, or how many hundreds of thousands of dollars have
been saved by increasing the D.W.I. arrest by 318% over the three (3) year
period and removing 13,509 drunken drivers from the streets. Nationwide statistics
PAGENO="0035"
31
confirm that a driver at .10% B.A.C. (Blood Alcohol Content) is seven (7) times
more likely to become involved in a traffic accident than a sober driver and the
probability increases to 25 times at .15% B.A.C. We do not arrest any driver
registering under .10% on the Breathalyzer.
The implementation of the A.S.A.P. program in the beginning of 1975, provided
a different enforcement concept. This concept includes three types of enforce-
ment patrolling; Expressway, Evaluation Areas, and Roving Patrol. Description
of the Patrols are as follows:
Ea~pressway.-On Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights, evaluation patrols are
conducted on five of the ten sections of the 117 mile expressway system selected
for expressway patrol evaluation based on prior accident experience. This system
has historically been a high risk area, having 20% of the fatal accidents and
persons killed during 1972-1974. As experience is gained, these areas may under
go change. When a point of diminishing returns is reached, the expressway
evaluation patrols will be shifted to the second set of five sections.
Evaluation Areas.-Two evaluation areas were selected jointly by S.A.P.D.
and the Project Evaluator. Area A, on the north side of San Antonio, is densely
populated area with approximately 106 alcohol-related accidents in 1974. Area B
is less densely populated, but has more highspeed throughfares and numerous
taverns. There were approximately 221 alcohol-related accidents in Area B in
1974. It can thus be determined, which type of area is more responsive to em-
phasized patrolling. Area B is located in the south central part of San Antonio.
Roving Patrol.-The City's roving patrol units will patrol the same area each
night for one week, rotating weekly from one roving patrol area to another in a
planned pattern. There are six City roving patrol areas, excluding the two City
evaluation areas and the expressways. The size of a roving patrol area is
approximately inversely proportional to its alcohol-related accident experience;
hence, weekly rotation gives equal roving patrol coverage in all patrolled areas.
This concept was implemented on July 1, 1975.
The patrol hours and man-hours of the ASAP Selective Enforcement Patrols
are as follows:
Wednes-
Patrol units
Monday
Tuesday
day
Thursday
Friday
Saturday
Sunday
Weekly
Expressway__.~
Evaluation area A & B
0
4
0
4
0
4
0
4
10
6
10
6
5
4
25
32
Roving patrol
4
4
4
4
4
4
28
Total
8
8
8
8
20
20
13
85
Supervisors
Detective-investigators
Hours: Patrol hours, night_...._
1
1
5
1
1
5
1
1
5
1
1
5
2
2
2 6
2
2
2 6
1
1
2 6
9
9
38
1 9:30 p.m. to 2:30 a.m., 5 hr.
2 9:30 p.m. to 3:30 am., 6 hr.
The plan as originally submitted to the Department of Transportation for the
renewal of the contract for ASAP for `the years 1975 and 1976, was not acceptable
to the Police Department `as far as the Enforcement Countermeasure was con-
cerned. This plan called for concentrated enforcement in one geographic area of
the City which is predominantly underprivileged and predominantly one par-
ticular ethnic group. Also it dictated the assignment of police officers `by an
agency other than the Police Department.
Our contention was that the Expressway System was historically high in one-
ear fatal and severe injury accidents. This is, `of course, indicative of drinking
and driving. This we verified by a study of one vehicle accidents on the Express-
w'ay System. It was further verified by voluntary roadside surveys of drivers
exiting via Expressway ramps. Survey's were conducted on Friday and Saturday
nights. Three Hundred drivers volunteered to partcipate in the survey. Of these
participants, 48.3% had `been drinking and of `these, 22.8% were D.W.I.
Since implementation of the Expressway ASAP Patrol in July of this year, we
have worked eight nights (four Fridays and four Saturdays) and have arrested
63 D.W.I.'s. This, we consider, is good enforcement for two reasons: first, it is
obvious that the D.W.I.'s are on the Expressway's, not only endangering their
o'wn lives `but also the lives of other innocent persons, and secondly there can
be no accusations of harassment as `all ethnic groups use the Expressways as
well as persons from every geographic area of `the City.
PAGENO="0036"
32
Officers assigned to the A.S.A.P. patrol have only one function, to detect and
apprehend drunken drivers. However, they are `still police officers, and although
they are not given any routine calls by the police dispatcher, they are instructed
to take the necessary police action on on-sight violations of the law. Also, on any
emergency such as burglars in action, armed robbery in action, etc. and they
are in the immediate vicinity, they are to make the scene along with the regular
on-duty patrol officers. From January, 1972 through March. 1974, 33,667 arrests
other than D.W.I.'s were made by ASAP patrols. During this period, we did not
differentiate `between hazardous moving violation arrests and criminal arrests.
Beginning in April 1974, we separated the hazardous moving violation arrests and
the other arrests. Other arrests consist of Drunk, Burglary, Robbery, Car
Prowls, IJunla'wfully Carrying Prohibited Weapon, Narcotics Violations, etc.
From that date through July 1976 (16 months), ASAP patrols made 14,155
hazardous moving violation arrest's and 570 other arrests.
In conclusion, I will state that in our estimation the ASAP patrol has `been
of tremendous value `to the safety and welfare of the citizens of San Antonio.
I migh't add that although the program is `basically funded w-ith federal funds,
the City of San Antonio has also contributed. The undersigned utilizes approxi-
m'ately 25% of his on-duty time on the ASAP program. Others utilizing on-duty
time on ASAP include Captain of `Traffic, 5%; Sergeant of Traffic (ASAP C~-
ordinator) 100% Assistant ASAP Coordinator 50%; Clerk III. 90%; Traffic
Analyst, 12%; and Record Bureau Computer Clerk, 10%.
Inspector FITCH. All right, sir. I would like to go back to the be-
ginning of the program, how we determined the sites. We did in-
depth studies of alcohol-related accidents and from these studies,
coupled with roadside surveys, we were able to `determine the high-
incident areas.
After that we began training a select group of officers-
Mr. WRIGHT. You are speaking of sites for intense patrolling to
detect incidents of driving while intoxicated?
Inspector FITCH. Right, sir. After determining the sites, we con-
ducted a training program of selected officers. This was all to be off-
duty work, overtime work for the officers.
When we first proposed this approach to the problem, we met with
a little opposition-I might put in as an aside-from the folks at
IDOT. It seems that they are a little opposed to paying time and a
half. They proposed to hire an additional 25 officers and pay for the
training of these officers; pay for their salary for 3 years; pay all the
fringe benefits, and then, as they went into the police department, pull
25 other older officers out to assign to the ASAP patrols.
Well, `we were finally able to convince t;hern that in our opinion this
would not work. A twofold reason: When you take the older officer,
he generally is a family man, has children; with any seniority, he has
Saturday and Sunday off; and to put him on the ASAP program, it
is all nights, he loses Saturdays and Sundays, and if you have the
same officers arresting the major portion of DWI's, when he is sup-
posed to be off duty getting some rest, lie is in the courts all the time.
And we further proved to them that it would `be cheaper to go the
overtime route-that is just a little aside on how we got onto this
overtime.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, I can see that from a budget standpoint, you
can maximize the effectiveness of your force through the overtime
route at a lesser total expenditure of funds than if you had to hire
entirely new people.
Inspector FITCH. Right. That was our point. And we had a second
point in mind: We wanted to get as many officers involved in this
thing as possible so that when they were on their regular patrol, they
PAGENO="0037"
33
would be trained to detect and apprehend DWI's, not only when they
were just on ASAP.
Mr. WRIGHT. You can isolate the certain hours of the day and the
certain times of the week when the problem is most prevalent, but
that does not mean that it does not exist at other times.
Inspector FITCH. That is correct.
Mr. WRIGHT. And so your aim was to develop as much expertise
within your department as possible so that through this training they
could more effectively conduct the enforcement in their normal course
of duty.
Inspector FITCH. Twenty-four hours a day, 7 days a week. And
it has paid off, as I will go into a little later on.
l~\Te actually began patrolling the first part of 1972, that is, the ASAP
inforcement patrols, and in the 3 years, 1972, 1973, and 1974 of
ASAP patrolling, our D'V~TI arrests went up 318 percent over 1969,
1970, and 1971. Now, it was due primarily to the selective enforcement
of ASAP patrols. However, the carryover was there, because we had
550 officers training.
Mr. WRIGHT. You said that initially you began training selected
officers.
Inspector FITCH. Correct.
Mr. WRIGHT. Are you saying that in the 3-year period you have
trained a total of 550?
Inspector FITCH. Correct, sir. Over a period of time, of course; not
all at the beginning.
Mr. WRIGHT. Not all at once. Well, how does this compare-this
would be pretty nearly your entire force, would it not?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. We have-
Chief PETERS. 1,100.
Mr. WRIGHT. About half-you have 1,100?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. I see. I was underestimating the number.
Inspector FITCH. We have approximately 1,100 officers on the force
Now, getting back to my remark about the benefit of the training, the
carryover into the regular patrol; an analysis was made during the
period April and May-just 2 months-of this year and we had 3
groups in there of 50 officers each.
Group 1 were the officers who were trained in March of this year;
group 2 were the officers who were previously, way back in the begin-
ning of the program in 1971, and again in 1972 and some in 1974.
Now, group 1-the ones who were trained in March-that group on
their regular patrols averaged 27 arrests per month; group 2, who
were trained back in the early stages of ASAP, averaged 10.5; the
third group, who were untrained, averaged 8 arrests.
Now, that told us two things-well, primarily one thing: It indicates
a need for inservice refresher training for those fellows who were
trained in the early stages of ASAP, and this will be implemented. I
have already d1scussed it with Sgt. Flesher.
Mr. WRIGHT. I was going to ask if the injection of the training had
worn off or if the quality of the training had just improved.
Inspector FITCH. No; I think it just wore off, so we want to give
them a little booster shot, so to speak-inservice training.
Now, as I said before, the arrests increased 318 percent-
PAGENO="0038"
34
Mr. WRIGHT. You do not give an officer a quota or anything like
that?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. You do not grade him upon the basis of how many
arrests he-
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. We do do this, now: When an officer goes
out there with the sole responsibility of detecting and apprehending
DWI's, the first thing we have to establish is probable cause for stop-
ping the vehicle and, of course, the probable cause is a hazardous mov-
ing violation. Now, any man-any officer in the city of San Antonio
that can go out there 5 hours on some nights and on others 6 hours
and not show any activity whatsoever, something is wrong. I do not
mean they have to get a DWI every night. Of course, we know better
than that. But he has to see some hazardous moving traffic vioJations-
he has to.
[Laughter.]
Mr. WRIGHT. He is not looking if he does not see any.
Inspector Fitch. That is correct. So that particular officer when we
see this, the coordinator says: "Come on in here. I want to have a tall~
with you," and he will get down to this thing: "Look, you are being
paid time and a half and we know there are traffic violations out there,
and when you show no activity whatsoever"-we do not expect him to
get a DWI every night, but we do expect some activity out there.
Mr. WRIGHT. Now, while an officer is on the ASAP patrol, if he
encounters other activity that would be within the scope of a. police
officer's duties, I trust that he does not. look the ot.he.r way and ignore
that, either. I suppose much of the time lie encounters other violations
and things that he must attend to.
Inspector FITCH. That is absolutely correct. I cover that-officers
assigned to the ASAP patrol have only one function. to detect and
apprehend drunken drivers.
They are not subject to any routine call from the dispatcher. How-
ever, they are to take action on any onsite violation of the law and any
emergency arising in their immediate area, they are to respond with
the regular onduty men.
In fact, from January 1972 through March 1974, 33,667 arrests other
than DWI's were made by ASAP patrols. During this period we did
not differentiate between a hazardous moving violation-the majority
of them were hazardous moving violations establishing probable cause.
We did not differentiate between those and the criminal arrests.
However, beginning in April of 1974 we separated them. Now, other
arrests consist of drunk, burglary, robbery, car prowls, unlawfully
carrying prohibited weapons, narcotics violations, and so forth. From
April of 1974 through July of 1975-16 months-they made 14,155
hazardous moving violation arrests and 570 other arrests, and many of
them were for burglary, hijacking, and that sort of thing, so, no, in
answer to your question, Mr. Chairman, they are policemen first.
Mr. WRIGHT. If they see a man breaking and entering. they do not
just ignore him because lie seems to be sober.
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. Definitely not. Now, we changed our con-
cept of enforcement beginning July 1, 1975. We have three types of
ASAP patrol. We have what we term the expressway patrol, the
evaluation areas, and the regular roving patrol.
PAGENO="0039"
35
Now, briefly-I will not go into detail on these things-but, briefly,
the evaluation areas; one of the areas is on the north side of the city.
It is densely populated with approximately 106 alcohol-related acci-
dents in 1974. That is one of the areas.
The other area is on the south side of the city. It is less densely popu-
lated, but it has more high-speed thoroughfares and numerous taverns.
There were approximately 221 alcohol-related accidents in area B in
1974.
We hope Southwest Research can determine which type of area is
more responsive to emphasized patrolling. We selected those two areas.
Now, on the roving patrol, we have six areas in the city. We have
four officers assigned each night to this roving patrol and the areas
were selected-the size is approximately inversely proportional to its
alcohol-related accident experience. So these six areas, one may be a
little, small area and the other a much larger area. However, on
alcohol-related accidents they are the same.
These roving patrols stay in one area for 1 week. Then they are
moved to another area. In other words, they encompass the whole city.
Mr. WRIGHT. An officer is transferred-do I understand it that an
officer who is patrolling one area for 1 week will patrol another area
the next week, but that does not leave this area uncovered? Is that
correct, or am I mistaken?
Inspector FITCH. No, that particular area in uncovered.
Mr. WRIGHT. I see. You have to do it on a spot basis.
Inspector FITCH. Right. Now, the freeways, the expressways, the
plan that was originally submitted to the DOT did not include that.
That plan called for concentrated enforcement in a geographic area of
the city which is predominantly underprivileged and predominantly
one ethnic group. We did not like that-the reason should be obvious.
So we contended the expressway system was historically high in
one-car fatal and severe injury accidents and this, of course, is indic-
ative of drinking and driving. So we conducted a study and verified
that-one-vehicle accidents on the expressways.
Mr. WRIGHT. I cannot imagine why the Federal Highway Adminis-
tration people would have been adverse to the idea of patrolling on
expressways.
Inspector FITCH. The plan submitted to them did not contain this. It
was not the DOT people, but the plan submitted did not contain-
Mr. WRIGHT. The plan submitted by the city of San Antonio?
Inspector FITCH. Correct, sir. That is right. So, as I say, we wanted
the expressway system and we wanted to get out of this predicament
of concentrating night after night after night in this underprivileged
area which is predominantly one ethnic group-
Mr. MYERS. Excuse me, sir. At that time did that area have ex-
tremely large death concentrations due to accidents?
Inspector FITCh. Death concentration, no, but it was-
Mr. MYERS. It was just surveys that revealed that?
Inspector FITCH. They had numerous alcohol-related accidents, ye&
They are getting the patrol, but not every night-no, not every night,
every night, every night.
Mr. WRIGHT. Not to the exclusion of other areas.
Inspector FITCH. Correct, sir, because we have DWI's all over town.
Mr. MYERS. Was there objection from that area of the community
to a concentrated effort? Was it felt that it was not one of assisting
them but one of harassing them?
PAGENO="0040"
36
Inspector FITCH. Correct.
Mr. M~-E1is. Have you turned that attitude around, that the inten-
tion was to reduce the death and injury rather than to just harass?
Inspector FITCH. I believe the Chief can comment on that, because
he took the brunt of that when we w-ere there every night.
Chief PETERS. We tried to experiment with this for aproximately
2 months in 1974 before the application for the new continuation
money, and the feedback was already building up strongly that. this
was harassment.
So we went back to another study and we think that by substituting
the plan to increase enforcement on the expressways. we meet every
driver somehow or somewhere and we meet all ethnic groups where
it cannot be pointed out that we are picking on one or the other.
The expressway system in San Antonio is such that practically
everyone traversing from one point to another at one point, gets on
the expressway, and if they are a. drunken driver. I think we are going
to intercept them there rather than concentrating in his neighborhood.
Mr. WRIGHT. `Well, San Antonio has an enviable network of express-
ways.
Chief PETERS. Correct. If you drive more t.han 3 or 4 miles. it. is to
your advantage timewise to enter the freeway system. because it is
like a big wheel with spokes, and it will just take you in most. any
direction, so we think that we are meeting the problem head on, and
yet it is not-it does not have the overlook of concentrating on just
a certain type of people, although, as Inspector Fitch pointed out,
the accident statistics could justify our concentration program. but
I just do not think it would have been well accepted by the public.
Mr. WRIGHT. Do I understand that when you decided that you
wanted to expand coverage so that you could get. out on the express-
ways too, you had to justify that to the DOT people.?
Chief PETERS. Correct. This was a substitute.
Mr. WRIGI-IT. Fine. But, now, your experience as a result of having
done that, has it satisfied you that it was a wise decision to do this, to
cover the expressways?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. I cannot imagine why it would not be.
Inspector FITCH. Before we went on the freeway system. in addi-
tion to our accident surveys we conducted roadside surveys, persons
driving cars exiting from the ramps. Now. 300 drivers volunteered
to participate in this survey. Of these participants, 48.3 percent had
been drinking, and of these 22.8 perc.e.nt were driving while intoxi-
cated.
Mr. WRIGHT. You define driving while intoxicated as a person who
is revealed by the breathalyzer test as having more than one-tenth of
1 percent of alcohol in his bloodstream?
Inspector FITCH. Correct.
Mr. WRIGHT. That is the legal definition within the- State of Texas,
isn't it?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir. Now, we only implemented this program
July, 1975, because we could not. get. clearance. We have been on that
freeway now four Fridays and four Saturdays in the month of July-
8 nights. We have arrested 63 DWI's in 8 nights. So they are
there a.nd we knew they were there and now we are apprehending
ftem and we will apprehend them.
PAGENO="0041"
37
Mr. WRIGhT. The total number of accidents-follow me through and
see if I am right in this because I am guessing-the total number of
accidents per flow of traffic, per traffic volume, might not be as high
on the freeway system, but the number of fatal and really serious ac-
cidents would be much higher, would it not?
Inspector FITCH. That is right..
Mr. WRIGHT. Because they are moving faster?
Inspector FITCH. That is correct. Now, I mention one other thing-
the question was asked of some preceding person: "Can you show any
results-tangible results?"
Well-I believe it was Mrs. Cockrell-it is very, very difficult be-
cause you do not know how many you have prevented. However, I did
a little study and went back 10 years to 1966 and compared the traffic
deaths as of August 7, yesterday, year by year and also the square
mileage of the city.
Now, in 1966 as of August 7, we had 54 persons killed and the
city was 182 square miles.
Now, in 1971, the year prior to ASAP, we had 59 people killed and
the city had grown to 197 square miles, or an 8-percent increase in
square mileage.
In 1972, the first year of ASAP, 61 persons were killed, but in De-
cember of 1972 the city annexed a huge area-the city grew from that
original 182 square miles to 251 square miles. Now, this was an area
that had practically no traffic enforcement. People did not know what it
was at that time. They had high-speed arterials, high-speed freeways,
and everything else. So the full impact of that hit us in 1973, when we
had it for the full year. In 1972 we just had it for December.
Eighty persons were killed, which was an increase of 48 percent
over the 1966 figure, and the square mileage was 253, which was a 36-
percent increase.
Mr. MYERs. May I interrupt you for 1 second at that point?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. MYERs. Was there a significant-can you identify how many
were in the area of the newly acquired mileage?
Inspector FITCH. I do not have that at my fingertips, but I do have
it. It accounts for a substantial number of those, this newly annexed
area.
Now, in 1974, the second year of ASAP, we had 76 killed, which was
a little reduction over the previous year. It was 41 percent over the
54 in 1966.
Now, in 1975, this year, as of yesterday, we have had 55 persons, an
increase of 2 percent over the 54 of 1966 and the square mileage has
gone up 45 percent.
Now, I am not saying that ASAP helped us. I am not that naive.
But we have other programs, also. We have the STEP program, for
example, which is handled through the Governor's office, the selective
traffic enforcement program. We are utilizing that. We have what we
consider the finest emergency medical service in this part of the coun-
try. They save lives, also.
But, truthfully, I believe that ASAP has contributed largely to
it. That would conclude my remarks.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you. Are there questions?
Mr. MILFORD. I have a couple that I would like to get into.
PAGENO="0042"
38
I get a little bit worried sometimes in reading driving-while-in-
toxicated statistics and other factors. Some years back one of the real
interesting experiences I had was wearing a badge in the city of
Irving, Tex., as a police officer. In the days that I was an officer, DWI
tests were made rather unscientifically, like, "Stand up and put your
fingers to your nose," [indicating] and the usual type of things.
Subsequent to that time we have come to the breathanalyzer that al-
lows the police officer to make an instant evaluation and also allows
scientific statistical gathering of information. When did the breath-
analyzer generally come into use in the State of Texas?
Inspector FITCH. To the best of my recollection, it was around 1970
or 1971.
Mr. MILFORD. So that we now have a little bit better way to gain
hard statistics on this particular problem than we have had in the
past.
Inspector FITCH. That is correct.
Mr. MILFORD. And I am wondering if this is being fed into the eval-
uation that we use.
Chief PETERS. We did use-I think the name was Harger drunk-
ometer-which was a measurement of alcoholic content and also
through the breath, but we do not think it was as efficient as the
breathalyzer, however.
Mr. MILFORD. Thank you very much.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Levitas.
Mr. LEVITAS. Thank youq Mr. Chairman.
In order to get some background information generally about the
legal situation in Texas-I know the chairman and Congressman Mil-
ford are more familiar with this than those of us from out of the
State-and I mean from an objective and not personal experience
point of view, Mr. Chairman [laughter]-
Mr. WRIGHT. Tha.nk you.
Mr. LEVITAS. I would like to just get a few things in the record. A
person who is convicted-first offense-of driving while intoxicated,
is there a mandatory loss of license?
Inspector FITCH. Yes; on final conviction, but not on probation.
Mr. LEVITAS. If a person goes on probation, they would not lose their
licence even if convicted?
Inspector FITCH. That is correct.
Mr. LEVITAS. Do you have a system of nob contendere pleas in*
Texas?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir; we do.
Mr. LEVITAS. Does it apply to DIVI as well. and if it does, is there a.
loss of license if the judge accepts nob contendere?
Inspector FITCH. There would be a loss of license if it is a c~nvic-
tion. If it is nob contendere and he probates it, there is no loss of
license.
Mr. LEVITAS. Do your statistics show what percentage of arrests for
DWI involve repeaters who have been previously convicted within the
prior 24-month period?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. LEVITAS. Do you know offhand wha.t those figures are?
Inspector FITCH. Well, I have it 1972, 1973, 1974. and then a com-
pilation of the 3 years, but these are only three times or more. There
are numerous two-timers.
PAGENO="0043"
39
Mr. LEVITAS. What would the three times or more be, Inspector?
Inspector FITCH. Well, in 1972, it was 35.
Mr. LEVITAS. Thirty-five percent?
Inspector FITCH. No; 35 persons.
Mr. LEVITAS. Thirty-five persons.
Inspector FITCH. Over three-three or over.
Mr. WRIGHT. Three or over during that calendar year?
Inspector FITCH. Correct.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thirty-five persons were apprehended and arrested
on DWI charges three or more times during that year?
Inspector FITCH. During that year, right-1972.
Mr. LEVITA5. And did you say you also had the figures for 1974?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. LEvITAS. What would those figures be for 1974?
Inspector FITCH. There were 17. And then I have compiled it here
for the 3-year period, and these are 4 or more over the 3-year period,
and there were 35 of them.
Mr. LEVITAS. Under your ASAP program-and perhaps this will
go to Mr. Hawkins who will be here later, I understand-do you dif-
ferentiate for your statistical purposes between a driver who is drunk,
a drunk who is a driver, and a drinking driver-I do not know if I am
making myself clear, but I am talking about the difference between a
person who is not a habitual drinker, an alcoholic, but is in fact under
the influence, on the one hand, and the person who is a confirmed al-
coholic-who has an alcohol problem, on the other, in terms of keeping
your statistics for repea.ted offenses.
Inspector FITCH. No, sir; we do not keep that. I think Mr. Langland
keeps that. We do not.
Mr. LEVITAS. Now, did I understand in the early part of your re-
marks, Inspector Fitch, that you said that there had been a 78-percent
increase in arrests since the ASAP program was put in?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. Over the 3 years, it has been a 318 percent.
Mr. LEVITAS. And you attribute a large impact in reduction of death
to the ASAP program.
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir; I do.
Mr. LEVITAS. Now, I have always held the view that one of the best
ways to bring about deterrence of any crime, whether it is driving
under the influence or burglary, is the assurance or the likelihood of
arrest and conviction, and would you not agree with me that the very
fact that there has been an emphasis on DWI offenses, a police force
which has become highly trained in this area and sensitive to it, and
a concentrated effort of apprehension, is in itself a large portion of the
effectiveness of the ASAP program in decreasing the number of deaths
that you have described?
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir.
Mr. LEVITA5. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. While we are on that statistic-I know Congressman
Myers has some questions-I have one that might logically follow on.
Let me submit for the record the following numbers of DWI arrests:
First, for the 3-year period prior to the inauguration of the ASAP
program, 1969, 1,002; 1970, 1,137; 1971, 1,096, for a 3-year total of
3,235-a fairly constant level.
Now, with the onset of the ASAP program, in 1972 there were
4,913 DWI arrests; in 1973, there were 4,618; and in 19~74, there were
PAGENO="0044"
40
3,978. Now, the 3-year total is 13,509 or a. 318-percent increase over
the preceding 3-year period.
An interesting collateral question arises: During the 3 years of the
ASAP program, the number of arrests on these charges has declined
a bit annually, from 4,900 to 4,600 to 3,900. To what do you attribute
that gradual decline? Are the officers who are enforcing it becoming
a little less zealous or, hopefully, have you created a situation in
which there are fewer incidents of driving while intoxicated?
Inspector FITCH. Mr. Chairman, I think it is the. latter. The fear
of apprehension. There are not as many on the streets.
Mr. MILFORD. Will the gentleman yield?
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, to the extent that that is t.rue~ that is a. mark of
success that we should not ignore.
Inspector FITCH. The reason I say that, this year. the first. 7 months,
we have arrested 2,223, so that means we are running slightly over
300 a month, and we are working just as hard and we have. more. men
out there now.
Mr. WRIGHT. Congressman Ka.zen asks an interesting question in
that connection, and I think Mr. Milford and Mr. Myers both have
questions-we have talked about the arrest. record. Do we have com-
parable sta.tistics with regard to the conviction rate?
Inspector FITCH. I do not. have them.
Mr. WTRIGHT. 1,Ve might have to get them from someone else.
Mr. MILFORD. Are these not. convictions here?
Mr. WRIGHT. These are arrests. The figures we have been reciting
are arrests, and we were trying to make some correlation with the
rate of conviction. I think we will be able to get that later today from
another of the witnesses, prdbably from Tom Hawkins.
Inspector FITCH. Mr. Chairman. may I say one thing: The police
and the attorneys have differences of opinions on that.
Mr. WRIGHT. I understand that.
Inspector FITCH. They consider probation as a. conviction. We. do
not. In the State of Texas, it is not a final conviction, and we do not
take the driver's license.
Mr. MILFORD. All I wanted to bring in was one thing. and it ties into
the question I asked a while ago, that there is a vast difference now
in the ease of convicting a. man for DWI than there was prior to 1971
as a result of the breathalyzer.
Inspector FITCh. That is correct.
Mr. MILFORD. This thing prett~ well sums it. up so that if you have
a breathalyzer test with one-tenth of 1 percent. von have. pretty much
got a conviction, so that part. of the dramatic. rise, in the figures pr~o1'
to 1972 might also be attributed to the new `aws and use of the breath-
alyzer by police forces. Would that. also be a factor?
Inspector FITCh. Yes, sir.
Mr. MYERS. Inspector, do you have any idea how many citizens in
San Antonio have seen this wallet-size card?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir, I do not.
Mr. MYERS. This is a card which indicates to the. person by weight
how ma.ny drinks he can have of either 11/2 ounce 80 percent liquor or
12 ounces of beer~ just for the record. and is an attempt. to communi-
cate to individuals how much they should be able to consume before
being under the influence, but you have no evuJu~tion of what. per-
PAGENO="0045"
41
centage of the population in the project area have been exposed to this
and by what means they have been exposed to it?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. The only thing that I know-I would
think Sergeant Flesher, my coordinator, could speak to that.
Sergeant FLESHER. Those cards are distributed in the evaluation
area by the roadside survey teams when we stop them and also through
Nancy Brennan, who is in Mr. Langland's office, and through schools
and all the other type of communications that she makes, and we also
set up booths-I hope you come over to see it at the folklife festival
which is going on right now. We have a booth with the breathalyzer
set up, `and we distribute it to anyone who would like to take the
test-voluntarily, that is.
Mr. MYERS. I possibly should ask that of Mr. Hawkins later.
Sergeant FLESHER. I `have no idea of the percentage.
Mr. MYERS. In regards to the statistics of the number of arrests,
Inspector, you indicated that possibly the reason that they are coming
down is because there are fewer drunken drivers-and I would hope
that that were true. However, I would like to ask some questions .i~
regard to detection by the general public of your efforts.
In other words, is the general public aware of the hours and the
locations at which yoi~ are located, and is there any evidence that that
in itself diverts traffic from those areas of possible detection? Have
you `had any evaluation as to the operation of CB radios, networks
which alert possible violators to avoid certain areas, and in general,
general kind of `counteroperations that you are taking to insure the
security of your operations from this type of submarining?
Inspector FITcI-I. I do not think that we are bothered at all by that.
Now, in our radar operations `it is different. But here, you see, our
patrols are moving constantly. WTe do not sit and wait for something
to come. We are patrolling.
Like, for example, on a Friday and Saturday night-let's see, we
have 10 men on the freeways-b units-we have 6 units in the evalua-
tion areas, and we have 4 units in the roving patrol, so there is no way,
you know, that they could keep up with us.
Mr. MYERS. You are convinced, as `an answer for the record, that
you have a secure situation which would not be easy to avoid inten-
tionally by the general public?
Inspector FITCH. Right.
Mr. MYERS. When officers who have been trained in this program-
the ASAP program-perform their normal duty, do they have a high-
er than average arrest record on that period of their duty, also in com-
parison to those who are not trained in that particular function?
Inspector FITcH.' Yes, sir.
Mr. MYERS. Do you know of any instances in the program where
violators of certain categories ha've been through the program as-
signed to your patrols or to patrols which answer at accident scenes?
In other words, exposed-
Inspector FITCH. I did not quite follow that.
Mr. MYERS. Has there been any attempt to familiarize people who
drink while driving with the on-scene results of death and physical
destruction that has resulted in order to try to encourage them to find
alternate ways of transportation?
PAGENO="0046"
42
Inspector FITCH. Yes, sir. Our accident prevention bureau in the
police department, has as one of their basic jobs, to disseminate that in-
formation. They show films a.nd everything else.
Mr. MYERs. Do you know of any incident where. violators arrested
under the ASAP program assigned to this school have ever been taken
on scene at an accident to be able to have to live with that.?
Inspector FITCH. No, sir. We are not involved with the AIDE school
and other facets of the ASAP program. I was speaking of our func-
tions in the police department.
Mr. MYERS. In your opinion, do DWI's travel a. rather limited dis-
tance from their homes, on the average?
Inspector FITCH. That was t.he problem in the area tha.t we were
referring to-that the chief was referring to. You know. go to the
corner beer joint or two or three blocks from their home. and then an
ASAP vehicle would see them going all over the road and stop them,
and they are only a block or two from their home.
But the way we are set up now, no, they a.re a long ways fro1n their
homes.
Mr. MYERS. So that actually the system you a.re using now-my
understanding is that most fatal accidents happen in relatively close
distances to the driver's own home, the passenger's home. and that if
you do not recognize that in your program and you do not have a
program which addresses the neighborhood traffic, are you not really
losing the effectiveness of the program?
Inspector FITCH. Well, Congressman, we do address that problem
in our roving pa.trols.
Now, over a 3-year period, approximately 20 percent of our fatal
accidents occurred on these freeways, our expressways~
Mr. MYERS. How many?
Inspector FITCH. Twenty percent. So, naturally, that is why we
wanted to get on that freeway.
Mr. MYERS. And what percentage of your total mileage. of road is in
the freeway in town?
Inspector FITCH. Jack?
Sergeant FLESHER. 127.
Inspector FITCH. I believe it is 127 miles.
Mr. MYERS. Out of how many total miles in the city?
Chief PETERS. About 2,800 miles.
Inspector FITCH. The chief says approximaely 2,800 miles.
Chief PETERS. So much of this 2.800 is not heavy traffic.
Mr. MYERS. One final question: Where in the ASAP program that
is located in San Antonio do drivers who have been involved in a fatal
accident, and have been under the influence of alcohol. fit? Are they
excluded automatically? Are they included automatically? Or are they
just thrown in with the rest of the group and addressed the. same way?
Is there any difference between the. driver who has been involved in a
fatal accident and those who have not.?
Inspector FITCH. If I follow you correctly, you mean on our han-
dling of that person-the police handling of that person?
Mr. MYERS. The police handling it and their direction-the next
step, prosecution-or do you know, are they automatically excluded
from being sent to the school or automatically sent to the school?
Inspector FITCH. About the school, I cannot answer that.
Mr. MYERS. In your regard, there. is no difference in handling?
PAGENO="0047"
43
Inspector FITCH. Pardon?
Mr. MYERS. In regards to the police activity, I would assume that
there is no difference.
Inspector FITCH. In addition to filing a DWI, if it is a fatal acci-
dent, we also charge them with manslaughter.
Mr. MYERS. Did you have anything to add, sir?
Chief PETERS. No; I just wanted to make sure that he covered that
point. The charge would be different. We lose it at that point. It is
up to the courts to adjudicate it, and I could not swear that some of
those might be relegated to the school. I do not know.
Inspector FITCH. I do not know what happens to them after that
point. We file the cases over at the county-the district attorney's
office-and then they carry it from there.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, gentlemen, we certainly want to thank you. You
are the ones who are on the firing line on this program, and you have
provided us with much very useful information.
We are about to break for lunch. Our first witness following our
luncheon will be Ted Arevalo, chief of the misdemeanor section of the
district attorney's office.
I want to express our thanks publicly to the Frost National Bank
for permitting us the use of these hearing rooms, and our thanks to
Miss McClure for her help in transcribing the testimony.
Let us then be adjourned until approximately 2:15.
[Whereupon, at 1 :15 p.m., the subcommittee recessed, to reconvene
at 2 :15 p.m., the same day.]
AFTERNOON SESSION
Mr. WRIGHT. The subcommittee will come to order.
Our first witness this afternoon is Mr. Teodoro Arevalo, chief of
the misdemeanor section of the district attorney's office of Bexar
County.
Mr. Arevalo, it is very good to have you with us, and we appreciate
your patience being with us earlier, and we are sorry that we got a
little bit behind schedule. We had intended to visit with you this
morning, but thank you for staying.
TESTIMONY OF TEODORO AREVALO, CHIEF, MISDEMEANOR
SECTION, DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, BEXAR COUNTY
Mr. AREVALO. Glad to be here, sir, and I hope I can answer all your
questions.
I was not given any information basically as to what would be
covered at this time. I think you are probably interested in the activi-
ties of the district attorney's office in reference to this ASAP program,
and I guess the best way to work it would be to tell you chronologically
how we come about in this ASAP thing, if I may proceed at this time.
Mr. WRIGHT. By all means.
Mr. AREVALO. All right, sir. The district attorney's office has an
assistant district attorney assigned each night from approximately
7 o'clock in the evening until 4 o'clock in the morning and that attorney
joins a night magistrate. Presently they meet at the Municipal Courts
Building, which is also the San Antonio Police Department and which
is right across from the Bexar County Jail.
PAGENO="0048"
44
When a subject is arrested by a peace officer for the offense of driving
while intoxicated, the officer sometimes-quite often there are two
officers. One officer is booking the. defendant at the. Bexar County Jail
and the other one comes over to the night. magistrate building and
prepares a report, a preliminary report. what they call a field report..
This field report is then delivered to the assistant dist.rict attorney,
who evaluates the situation to determine whether or not. he is going
to file what we call a. magistrate complaint. When he determines that
he is going to do this, this report is also examined by the. night. magis-
trate to make an evaluation as to probable cause based upon t.he recent
opinion of the U.S. Supreme Court that the district. at.torney no longer
should hold-should never hold, really-the sole authority to deter-
mine whether or not a subject is going to be arrested.
After it is determined that the case is going to be filed, the ]udge
makes a memorandum in the court. docket. We have what we call a
magistrate's docket. It is a book kept. separate and apart from the
regular courts' docket and in this hook we have basically the informa-
tion to file on an individual. lYe have, the name of the case versus the
defendant; we have the type of offense, which would be DWI; the date,
which would be the date of the offense; the amount of the bond set. by
the magistrate; who the district attorney is; if there is a defe.nse attor-
ney known at that time, and then the amount of the bond set. This is a
bound book.
The entry is made in the book as t.o the probable cause. and the
complaint is prepared by the assistant district attorney.
At that time, using these IBM tools that we have for this XCIC deal,
we have a computer where we code it-they put what they call a judi-
cial number-a ~JN number-they put a CIT number-a CIT number
is a number given to anybody who is arrested for a particular offense
and that is his permanent number. It is like our social security number.
Once you are arrested, you are given a CIT number and that is-as far
as we are concerned-for the rest of your life. Any time you are ar-
rested again, we use the same CIT number to check your background
and see what you have.
This complaint or affidavit that is taken by the district attorney is
signed by the peace officer who brings the information. A copy of that
report stays with the night magistrate. The complaint is an affidavit
wherein we allege the essential elements of the offense. and that. coin-
plaint, that affidavit, stays with the assistant district attorney that
night.
During the process of the night magistrate's business, the night
magistrate goes down to the Bexar County Jail a.nd sees the. defendant
charged with the offense-as a side line, if it is a felonv~ there is a form
that is filled to advise the defendant of his rights. This wou'd come
about-which is not commonly done-when the officer feels that he is
going to book him that night for a felony DWI and he is advised of
his rights.
On a misdemeanor case. the judge does go across to the jail and talks
to the defendant as to his rights. and then the process for legal aid
or personal recognizance follows through.
The district attorney, at 4 o'clock in the morning, gets all his com-
plaints together and places them inside the night magistrate's book,
and he calls it a night and goes on home.
PAGENO="0049"
45
In the morning at approximately 8 a.m. * one of the secretaries from
the district attorney's office goes down to the sheriff's office where this
book is kept-this magistrate's book that I was talking about-and
she gets our complaints, the magistrate's complaints-what we call the
magistrate's complaints-and the forms which are filled in for felonies.
These cases are brought back for our computer girl who then checks
to see why he is in jail and it is coded accordingly.
The magistrate's complaints are given to our misdemeanor section,
to another misdemeanor section girl, who files them alphabetically,
and then we wait for the police agency to bring us a complete report
in order for us to evaluate the complete case.
Remember that we had a field report from the police officer. Now,
the following day or as soon as possible, we get a complete case-what
we call the case or the file-in reference to this particular offense.
The requirements that we have for the filing of DWI's, like any
other offense-of course, DWI's have certain additional requirements-
is that we have what we call a cover sheet. On that sheet it gives the
charge on the subject, of the defendant, his date of birth, the CIT
number, the address, and then there are other areas in there for them
to put in as to the officer, the detective-actually, these cases are
brought over by detectives-I believe the police department covered
this. The detectives bring over the cases.
We accept the case. There is a space on there for us to sign if we
are going to accept it. We put our name-whoever is accepting the
case-we date it and we time it-the time when we actually accept the
case.
Now, the cover sheet, of course, has the arresting officer's name and
other pertinent data.
The other thing that they give us in reference to DWI is the DWI
report which is a form all set out for the police department and this
has been developed across the years and is the best form, we believe,
that has ever been done, and it has areas in which it tells the condi-
tions of the individual, the physical condition of the individual, as to
standing, walking, turning~ and then they have staggering, swaying,
unstable-I believe is the other one-and the last one is unsure or some-
thing like that. And this is what we consider as to the physical ab-
normalities of the individual.
Above that there is another area where the officer puts down the
witnesses himself with a little box on the right-hand side which shows
whether the officer can testify as to the intoxication or merely putting
him behind the wheel.
If there was a wreck in that particular case we require that the
police department submit to us a copy of their accident report so that
we can evaluate the case a little bit better~ and there they list the
witnesses, what they can testify to, whether they can put him behind
the wheel or not.
Above that, of course, is the other pertinent data that we have-
that they provide us with the name, the address, the driver's license.
They even have the height, the weight, and some other descriptions
of the individual.
Another requirement that we have in that case is that they give us
a copy of the breathalyzer officer report or what we cafl the DL the
detective investigator who gives the breathalyzer test. He has a check
66-089 0 - 76 - 4
PAGENO="0050"
46
list that he follows through when he is performing the test on the
defendant. We require that they give us a copy of that-for several
reasons.
The copy shows us the condition of the equipment prior to the test.
In other ~rords, there is a known content-I believe somebody may
have covered already the breathanalyzer. We have a simulator. We
test the simulator; we see what the simulator was before the tests and
after the test the simulator is checked once more to see if they balance
out. If the simulator is not the same, we have a problem somewhere
along the way. In other words, this is another thing we determine in
evaluating what kind of a case we got.
The other thing we require, for practical purposes, you might say,
is the FBI fingerprint card. Every person booked in the Bexar County
jail is fingerprinted for FBI purposes and we turn in a report to them.
And another thing that we require that is very important is the rap
sheet or the arrest record of the defendant, the accused. Quite often
we just have one arrest record for the defendant.
Something that is very helpful, from the highway patrol we re-
ceive-the only way I can call it is a teletype. They shoot out a re-
quest and they get it back on a teletype and it tells us how many times
he has been arrested and where lie has been arrested in the State of
Texas. It tells us quite a bit.
But we do require that the law enforcement agency bring us some
arrest record. Sometimes the police officers will go to the sheriff's
department to make a check on their records. At a later date we get
a catchoff from all over the State from central filing, t.he State records,
as to the rap sheet of the defendant. And that is basically what we
have.
Now, in the rap sheet of the defendant we get the other information
that we are also looking at to evaluate the case. We look into the type
of employment. For example, on the rap sheet from the San Antonio
Police Department they have employment, and they have other mat-
ters like height, weight, color, marital status, things of that nature-
iust general information. They have also the information on that
rap sheet as to mug shots so we can get a picture of the defendant.
And with all of this information-when it meets all our require-
ments, they bring it over to our office. They bring us the case and our
girls check it out-our little index on complaints. We make a deter-
mination to see if a~ complaint was filed on this individual. If we can-
not file a complaint, then we go into this IBM equipment that. we have
and determine what is the status-the man is in jail and he was ar-
rested some time after 4 o'clock or so close to 4 o'clock that the police
officer did not have time to bring the paperwork across to the magis-
trate, and if that is the case, what we do is we assign it to an assist-
ant district attorney so a complaint can be filed and the man can get
back to work.
When that first girl picks up the magistrate's complaints, she checks
them on the tube herself and finds out if these people are in jail and
she marks them accordingly. Whenever we get the paperwork on our
magistrate's complaints, we find out whether or not the subject is in
iail and if he is in jail, we immediately try to get it down to court.
Now, in evaluating the case file, the different attorneys-we assign
the cases to the different attorneys and, therefore, keep track of them.
PAGENO="0051"
47
We have what we call a log sheet. When an officer comes in with a
number of cases he wants to submit for our evaluation and considera-
tion, we have the log sheet where he writes the name of the defendant,
he writes the charge, any number that they may have-in our situa-
tion, for example, we have police report numbers, an assignment
number-they give us the assignment number, the detective who brings
it in and whether or not the subject is in jail.
Thereafter we place the name of the attorney who gets the case and
evaluates it.
Now, we look at all these matters to evaluate the case, as I mentioned.
We look at the front of it-one of the first things we look for, of course,
is the test, and if he did not want to take the test we would look a little
deeper. But, anyway, one of the first things we look at when we get the
case is the test. There is a place where they type in the test, 19,20, what-
ever it is that the test may be.
The we go into this DWI report from the police department and
basically all the other law enforcement agencies have similar reports,
and we go into the evaluation of the case to see what we have.
After the attorney looks at the case and, first of all, makes a deter-
mination to see if we have a driving-while-intoxicated case. If there
is something wrong with the case-if we feel we do not have a driving-
while intoxicated case-then we stamp it with a little red stamp that
says, "No official action at this time." It means, for practical purposes,
the case is rejected and will not be prosecuted until further evidence is
submitted, and this could be from anything that the attorney evaluat-
ing the case feels that he does not have a case.
For example, there have been certain situations where the officer ar-
rested the individual for driving while intoxicated-and it is not very
often, but there have been cases-and the officer had good grounds to
believe that the subject was driving and after evaluating the case we
find out that none of the witnesses can really put him behind the wheel,
which is the basic element of driving while intoxicated. Therefore, we
stamp it and close out the case.
Now, if the assistant district attorney decides to accept the case for
filing purposes, then we consider first in the case if the rap sheet of the
defendant shows that he has never been arrested before or maybe one
or two drunk offenses or some minor type of offense, speeding ticket
or something like that, and if there is no accident, no property damage,
and if there is no injury to anyone individual as a result of this
DWI, and the test reads .18 and below-that includes .18-we have
several avenues to follow.
Once again, the case is evaluated from the point of view of the re-
mainder of the report. We look at the breathalyzer test; we look at the
rap sheet of the defendant; we look at what he does for a living. Then
the age of the defendant is also an important factor to consider, the
occupation, and if he did not give the police officer trouble at the time
of the arrest, then we feel that this is an individual who should be
given the consideration of the so-called ASAP program.
Now, the procedure at the present time is we accept the case and then
we mark it with what is called ASAP-rehab, for rehabilitation pur-
poses. What we do is-remember, we have him charged in the magis-
trate's complaint and more likely-in fact, in every case that we follow
the procedure, he is out on bond because we have checked the tube and
he has been released. `When we classify the case as such, we have a form
PAGENO="0052"
48
letter that we send to this individual, and basically what the form let-
ter says is that., "You have been arrested for driving while intoxicated,"
and basically the facts of the case, and we are offering him-and we are
going to recommend this ASAP. We give them the address of the
ASAP people, where they are at-
Mr. WRIGh1T. He receives this option in lieu of trial and conviction.
Mr. AREVALO. That is correct.
Mr. WRIGHT. If he accepts the ASAP treatment. program-
Mr. AREvALO. Right.
Mr. WRIGHT [continuing]. Then the conviction is not entered on his
record; there is no conviction.
Mr. AREVALO. Right.. More than likely what happens is this: The
letter goes out; the gentleman accepts; he goes directly to the ASAP
people and enrolls in the program, but. the letter says that the case may
be considered for a reduction-may be. It does not make. a. promise.
By the same token, if the subject gets another DWI, that. is. of
course, as far as we are concerned, null and void and for all practical
purposes we still have the second case.
But the man we send to the ASAP program. once we send him to
the ASAP. we depend on the ASAP people for their evaluation as to
what they feel may or may not be a problem, how they want. to handle
the ease.
This case is set aside under the special l)rocedure that we have got.
Now, the ASAP people keep in touch with us. We send them a. list, of
all cases where we send letters. When these people have completed
their ASAP-now, whatever it. may be-by ASAP, I am speaking here
if it may be a program that consists of the four sessions that they
have-and, of course, they will elaborate on this-to the 18 months
where they want to keep a. person under surveillance for 18 months. We
keep this aside.
The magistrate's complaint remains alive. The man remains on
bond, but we cannot dismiss at. this time.
Now, on his completion of the course. we get a report. from the
ASAP people as to the cooperation of the individual and so on, and
they make a recommendation as to what they have accomplished and
the attitude of the man. Then, when they report that to us, it is our
bailgame again.
We decide whether we are going to reduce the case or whether we
are going to dismiss after we consider all the factors-everything that
we have gotten, whether we are going to reduce it. and. once again.
the whole thing comes into play. The prior record of the defendant.
the age of the individuaL the occupation-the whole thing comes into
play.
And then we reduce it either in the counts- court-we can still file
it in the county court because we have a niag complaint and not. re-
arrest the individual, or we can take him clown to the justice of the
peace and take a fine down there. and, of course, the maximum fine
for public intoxication in the State of Texas is a ~200 fine.
Now, that is one road that we follow in these cases.
Now, the other one is where the subject is 0.19 or higher: 0.19 or
higher, we still have the same requirements of the records that the
police department submits. but we look at it with a little bit stronger
eye. lYe look at the record and, once again, what. we do on that case
is we just accept it. We do not mark it. ASAP-Rehab.
PAGENO="0053"
49
That case is then filed by that complaint-what we do in Bexar
County is we use our telephone typing center. We dictate our com-
plaint. We have everything programed by form book-and we dictate
the complaint. The complaint comes back and we file it in country
court.
Now, once it is filed in county court, the matter can still be con-
tinued by our office, up until the time that the judge begins to handle
the case. Now, once a subject appears before the court and pleads
guilty or is found guilty by the court on a trial before the court or a
trial by a jury, the district attorney's office, in 99.9 percent of the
cases-I cannot think of one right now where I, myself, have inter-
ferred-handles the procedure. The court will make a determination.
My understanding is that the courts in Bexar County do send those
people, that have been found guilty and applied for probation, to
the ASAP program, and the evaluation, I believe, is the same nature.
But this is under a court order for probation and the judge sets his
own ground rules in Texas as to what he wants done during proba-
tion. We do not get involved in it any more.
The next time we hear about it, the probation is terminated-if it
is terminated.
If the court feels at one time-gets a report from the probation of-
ficer-that the court wishes to revoke probation then that means actu-
ally that we should file a motion to revoke.. That is all the judge is say-
ing. Then the probation officer and the assistant district attorney get
together and prepare a motion to revoke probation based on the alle-
gations that the probation officer may have.
Mr. WRIGHT. I was going to ask that. If a DWI violates the condi-
tions of the probation, refuses to follow the instructions of the judge
to attend classes or receive t.reatment, who initiates the procedure to
revoke that probation?
Mr. AREVALO. From a technical point of view, the initiation is from
the district attorney's office because the district attorney's office must
file a motion to revoke in order to get the wheels going and get the
warrant out.
But for the practical base of it, the probation officer controls the
activity because we do not even get involved once he is on probation.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, do you have information available to you on each
of these people who are on probation as to whether or not they have
fulfilled the terms of probation?
Mr. AREvALO. The misdemeanor probation section-and the same
thing is applicable to the felony section-works it. out, and, this is one
of the reasons that we require that rap sheet I was talking about, the
arrest record. Whenever we get a rap sheet of a. defendant who has a
prior offense-and, remember, I was covering merely those who had
one arrest but no prior DWI's. But goin~ into the procedure of a per-
son who does have a DWI, a prior DWI-and quite often we do not
have a disposition-the arrest record of the police department has
the name of the defendant-on a line on a. blank sheet-the name of
the defendant, the charge; they have the police department number
or the assignment number; they have the arresting officer's number;
and then sometimes they have where it is filed, in what county
court.
Now, sometimes they have-and this is what we are striving for-
the disposition of the case. So when that complaint taker gets this
PAGENO="0054"
50
case-remember, he `is evaluating the case based upon everything he
has before him, which is the rap sheet-we demand that rap sheet from
the police agency and sometimes they have reasons for not bringing
it in, and say, "All right, we will expect it tomorrow."
But if we ha.ve a prior DWJ, what ~we do is we go into our records
because we have a ca.rd index where we have entered the disposition
of that prior case and find out what happened. In other words, we can
either trace it in our own card index; we can trace it by the central
country `criminal docket, criminal filing; or we can trace it through the
new system, through this electronic tube.
Mr. WRIGHT. This is not exactly what I had in mind with my ques-
tion.
Suppose a judge orders an offender as a condition of his probation
to attend these classes or to receive this treatment and he fails or
refuses to do so-say he goes once to one class and then does not show
up any more. WTho finds out about that and what happens then?
Mr. AREVALO. As a general rule these are matters which are con-
trolled by the probation officer. Our office, as a general rule, does not
get involved in that unless it comes to our attention somewhere `along
the line that something should `be taken on this case.
This is the probation `field and it is handled by the probation
officer.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, now, what would happen? Would he come to
you and suggest-come to the judge and suggest that the probation be
revoked?
Mr. AREVALO. Maybe not suggest because of the fact that strictly
it. is a judici'al function. What the probation officer, as a practical
matter, does is he has-let us take the situation where he would have
a problem, the subject gets arrested `again-
Mr. WRIGHT. I am not talking about the subject who gets arrested
again. I am talking about-
Mr. AREVALO. Did not go to the ASAP. All right. Did not attend,
say, the. second `class. The probation officer goes to the judge and tells
the judge, "Judge, I have this man here `and the re'port to `me is that
he has not attended probation."
The judge is going to make an evaluation to see what is to be done.
Mr. `WRIGHT. All right.
Mr. AREVALO. The judge advises the probation officer to come to the
district attorney's office for p~'ocessing.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have practiced law here in San Antonio prior to
your association with the district attorney's office, have you not?
Mr. AREVALO. Yes, sir. I have been practicing law for a total of 15
years-of that, 9 years in the district attorney's office.
Mr. WRIGHT. In those earlier years in private practice here, I sup-
pose you may have had occasion to represent clients on some oppor-
tunities who had been charged with DWI.
Mr. AREVALO. Yes, sir, I did.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have seen it, then, from both sides.
Mr. AREVALO. Right, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. As an attorney who has represented both individual
clients and Bexar County, what is your candid opinion of this
operation?
Mr. AREVALO. Well, I think the system is of great help because of
the different types of cases that I have been involved in with DWI-
PAGENO="0055"
51
the DWI are people who drink to the extent that they get involved in
this type of situation and is not just like any other type of offense.
Of course, the probation office does an outstanding job in these type
of cases and they have a volume that is really tremendous, and that is
something else to go into, but you find that the DWI has to be eval-
uated from each individual's point of view.
For example, I had a personal friend who was about 35 years old
and I was representing him at the time in private practice as a defense
attorney and he never got involved in any type of criminal activity
at all, even speeding tickets, that I could find out. A nice individual,
from my hometown, with a real fine family and children.
Well, he got involved with a DWI for drinking and, of course, I
talked to him and I spoke to the judge and we got him probation.
Well, less than 30 days after he got probation, lo and behold, he got
into another DWI, and that shocked me because I did not want him
to goto jail.
So I brought him in, and there had to be something different than
the regular type of violator of the law. There was something there that
I could not touch. So I brought him in and at the risk of being dis-
barred, I chewed him out and I said, "Well, you have a problem some-
where along the way that you have not told me about."
And he denied it, and I said, "I want to see your wife." So his wife
came in to see me and I said, "Look, let us get one thing straight. I
think there is something going on around here that you have not told
me about. You have a problem beyond his merely wanting to drink or
something like that."
And she said, "No, we do not have any."
And I said, "Like heck you do not. You have a man who goes
straight for 35 years and all of a sudden he gets two DWI's in a row.
You tell me that that is normal ?"
I had another type of situation now that I am in the District At-
torney's office that this other individual had-I think he had at least
two DIVI's. I did not know at the time until the evaluation of the case
that he was having domestic problems-this case was called to me by
an attorney. He said, "Ted, I have this problem. I hate for this man
to go to jail, lose his driver's license; it is a difficult thing for him to
go to work. He has youngsters in college"-the whole family back-
ground. He said, you know, "What can we do about this guy ?"
I said, "I do not know, but there is something that fails to meet the
eye."
And this is not the normal case that I refer to the ASAP people-
and I have about four or five test cases that I have referred to them.
Anyway, this was about 6 or 8 months ago. I did riot know at the
time-the attorney, I do not remember whether he told me or not-
but his wife was also divorcing the man.
I talked to the attorney here about 3 weeks ago about this same case,
and his behavior-he says, "You know, the woman was pressing for
divorce before; now she has not even mentioned it at all."
I have not heard any more complaints about it and he has not been
involved in any DWI's or anything at all.
So this is one of the cases that we are talking about where individ-
uals need further than merely a probation approach or merely a typi-
cal incarceration case.
PAGENO="0056"
52
Mr. WRIGHT. What did they do with this case?
Mr. AREVALO. I believe the case is still active in one of the county
courts at law.
Now, sometimes it is difficult and I cannot say it will work in every
case. Basically, you really have to evaluate each case. There have been
some cases where some attorneys have said: "What can we do with
this man?" And you look at the arrest record and say: "Forget it. You
are not going to accomplish anything with this individual." He is get-
ting into disorderly conducts and getting into fights-some individuals
are like that. Let's face it, you are not going to accomplish anything.
All you can do in those cases is set them up-if you will pardon
the expression-for a felony DWI. In other words, you get them on a
conviction and you call them-at least, I like my prosecutors to call
the defendant on the side with their attorney and said: "Look, man, I
am goihg to do this for you, but I want you to know you bring your
toothbrush; you are going to the penitentiary the next. time you do
this," and you just hope for the best that the guy does not come back.
We try to work them on a. misdemeanor and we have in fact. Our
ASAP has also brought to us in the. light, of different. systems and ap-
proaches where there is DWI seconds and, therefore. the cases that. do
not have any felony have been successfully prosecuted-
Mr. WRIGHT. We had testimony earlier about people who had bee.n
apprehended and charged three times in a year. There were 35 of such
people in 1 year and 17 another year. What. beppens. now, with a
person who is a repeated offender, who just continues to go out and
commit the same offense, driving while.int.oxicated?
Mr. AREVALO. You are talking about a repeat offender. Now. once
again, we have the old axiom that, "where there. is smoke. there is fire.."
But if you have an individual that. has been arrested before. what we
do-we try t.o do in all cases, remembering that we have quite a volume
of these matters. But we. do-in fa.ct, I just stressed it today wit.h t.he
complaint-takers, go into their prior DWI and see what happened.
Sometimes the DIVI is so poor in the other type of a situation where
you really did not have a DWI to begin with-it is our opinion we did
not have it to begin with. In that type of situation you would have to
evaluate it, whether or not you did have a DWI.
And then there is the other type of situa.t.ion where' von may have
a DWI tha.t was involved in a wreck, and sometimes we. run into the
problem where once the citizen has been paid for his damages-and
the citizen is the only one that can put him behind the wheel-the
citizen does not want to come to court any more. Now, that is a. dif-
ferent type of situation.
And we do evaluate so-called third offenses from the light of the
other-and we also evaluate it from the present offense that we have.
It does not necessarily mean that bec.ause a man was arrested before
that he was in fact guilty of DWI. So what we do is evaluate the
whole thing.
Mr. WRIGHT. What percentage of those to whom the option is given
to come into the ASAP treatment program accept that. option rather
than going tc trial?
Mr. AnEvAr~o. I can only remember of one case that the~ subject
refuse.d to go to ASAP. It was 0.12, and we. tried it and got a
conviction.
PAGENO="0057"
53
Mr. WRIGHT. What percent of convictions are you getting on DWI
cases where you go for a conviction?
Mr. AREVALO. All right, sir. I can only go on trials-last year was a
year where we did not have too many DWI's, but I believe last year
we ran about-J wish I could remember-there were only about 10
DWI trials. I do not try a large percentage of them. Most of our cases
are conviction; I would say a very small percentage is acquitted.
For, example, now-and I have to go in general. I do not remember
how many DWI's-we have had 39 jury trials; we have had 28 con-
victions, 1 hung jury, and, I think, about 9 acquittals.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, we heard testimony earlier aboUt the caseload.
I suppose there has been a large caseload increase in th~ district at-
torney's office since the strengthened and enlarged activity on the
part of the police department, but I gather from what you are saying
tha.t a large percentage of that caseload is handled now through the
ASAP treatment program rather than going to the court for a
conviction.
Mr. AREVALO. A good portion of them, on the so-called-what we
call a bypass.
I will give you an idea of how many we have had. We had 100
cases on 1 day brought into our office-approximately-and I went
down on some of the cases. About 32 of those were possible ASAP
bypass. I did not go into the rap sheets. I merely looked at the test.
And that is what we came across-not all 32 went into the bypass
because of the fact, once again, each case stands on its own merits, as
I called to your attention.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, if a fellow has a higher percentage than 0.18,
do you consider that he is not eligible, then, for the ASAP bypass?
Mr. AREVALO. As a practical matter, that is about right.
Mr. WRIGHT. He is pretty drunk, is he not?
Mr. AREVALO. Not merely on that alone-he is pretty intoxicated;
yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. If one-tenth of 1 percent is legally intoxicated in
Texas, 0.18 is double intoxicated, almost..
Mr. AREVALO. Right., sir; just about.
Mr. WRIGHT. So he is really very much intoxicated to register that
high.
Mr. AREvALO. Yes, sir. In fact, on these police reports. the forms
they fill out, on the right-hand side, the last entry they have is,
t'Unsure"-but is on standing, walkiing-and that "unsure" is th
minimum abnormality, to swaying, and then-it is staggering, the
other one-staggering and failing. Usually when they start hitting
those 0.18's and 0.19's they start gett.ing into staggering and falling-
at least one of those lines will be staggering and falling down or "can
hardly stand up."
On the back of that report, incidentally, the officer gives us a brief
set of facts, the facts which led to the arrest, and from that he tells
us also that the man was unsteady on his feet., and so on.
Mr. LEvITAS. Would the Chairman yield on this point?
Mr. WRIGHT. Surely.
Mr. LEVITAS. Incidentally, let me comment. that your testimony is
extremely lucid and comprehensive and, having heard many witnesses
over a number of years, to see it laid out as clearly and concisely as
you have is extremely helpful to me, and I have enjoyed your testimony.
PAGENO="0058"
54
But I do not understand this criterion of the. bypass based upon
how drunk a person is, as opposed to the other circumstances. For
example, a person who is a frequent drinker may end up with a 0.13
blood alcohol and do it frequently. A person who has gone to a party
one time and had two or three drinks may exceed this 0.18 level a.nd
not be eligible, for the bypass according to your criteria, and I do not
really understand the basis for the extent of intoxication as being the
determining factor of being placed in the judicial process or the by-
pass, and I think my colleague, Mr. Milford, has done some quantita-
tive computation on this.
Mr. MILFORD. It looks to me to be the difference, between one or pos-
sibly two drinks according to the little card.
Mr. AREVALO. Yes, sir, but also according to-once again. I will
let the experts talk to you about. alcohol-but as you are saturated.
that saturation also has the ability to burn off-we can get involved
in it.
You are right in what you mentioned, but that is not the only factor.
You have to draw the line somewhere, OK? Just where do you draw
it? Therefore, that is only one factor.
One of the factors that we do consider, as a general rule-now,
remember, I am giving you the general rule because there will be that
special case.
Let me tell you about a gentleman-this is not common. hut I have
seen some-I remember right now two cases in my lifetime. I did not
represent them as a defense attorney but I picked them up in the. dis-
trict attorney's office-0.33. That is pretty high, it is it not? All right.
The officer, I think, made an outstanding report and in his report. as to
the abnormalities of the defendant-incidentally, I said that the right
part only had "unsure." Well, I meant for abnormalities. The next step
is "sure"; sure standing, sure walking, sure turning. That. officer set
down for the principal so-called abnormalities or physical functions
of the accused "sure, sure, sure." Now. if you have a man who walks
sure, who turns sure, who stands sure, is he intoxicated?
Now, in the State of Texas, it says that 0.10 and higher is the pre-
sumption which is rebuttable by the facts, and the facts rebutted the
0.33. In fact, I checked the test right away-the little check card. Each
one of these things has a reason.
Now, going back, that is not the `only criteria, 0.18. We go into-and
I mentioned this before and this is why we require the rap sheet of the
defendant, and in that rap sheet we have who his mother is-you
know, his next of kin, it is in there-we have his wife; we have height,
weight, age; we have his employment. That. report from the police de-
partment also tells us-oh, whether he may be a t.ruckdriver. In other
words, that is, as a general rule, the criteria that we follow on the 0.18
but we do not saddle it that way because of the fac.t that. there are
many other elements to be considered.
But somewhere along the way you have to draw the line, and this is
what we consider.
Something that you all have not covered, and maybe I should not
bring it out, along these same lines-maybe I really should not-any-
way, I will. On the test, failure to take the test-now, gentlemen, if
you have a truckdriver-I have one situation that I remember where
this truckdriver, an interstate, not intrastate-an interstate truck-
driver, and the attorney showed me the Federal regulations control-
PAGENO="0059"
55
ling truckdrivers interstate and concerning the suspension of driver's
license upon conviction or probation-I do not know exactly what it
said about that.
That man's livelihood was that driving of that truck-he was about
47 years old, married, and had children. Now, I think it would be an
undue punishment to suspend that man's driver's license merely be-
cause he did not take the test, but it would also be unwise to just let it
go at that and let him go. So what we do is we consult the attorney-
in this particular case, we consulted the attorney, consulted with the
defendant, and we said, "Look, mister, we not only do not want to see
you again on a IDWI, but if you do by any stretch of the imagination
fail to take this test, then you are going to be suspended."
Once again, you, have to take each case on its own merits-it is the
same thing with the test.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have told him this, he then took the test, or what?
Mr. AREVALO. No, sir. He had failed to take the test. He was a truck-
driver and they were going to suspend his driver's license for inter-
state travel. There wa~ a regulation and the attorney showed it to me.
I did not know this.
Mr. WRIGHT. This was not a local citizen?
Mr. AREvALO. A local citizen, yes sir, but he was a truckdriver from
San Antonio who traveled interstate.
Mr. WRIGHT. He was not a repeated offender?
Mr. AREVALO. No, sir. But the failure to take the test would suspend
his driver's license even if he got probation. Now, he could conceivably
get a special driver's license-that is available-but, once again, an
undue expense and so on.
Mr. MYERS. May I ask was he driving his truck or an automobile?
Mr. AREVALO. His automobile, sir. Not related to his occupation.
So, once again, going back to you all's point; we evaluate from all
facts and circumstances; so we do have to lay the ground rules.
Mr. MILFORD. Would the chairman yield for one question?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes.
Mr. MILFOIm. I, first of all, think your program is a good one and I
should think the citizens of this town should be proud of the way it is
being handled.
From time to time we find that some of our Federal laws get in the
way of the way local folks might like to run their own community.
Have you had any difficulties, for ex~imple, with some of the equal
opportunities or equal treatment under the law interfering with this
program? Because, in effect, you are taking different people charged
with t'he same crime and treating them in a different manner. Have
you had any interference from any organizations, groups, or indi-
viduals under that aspect?
Mr. AREVALO. No, sir; and I think one of the reasons-or the main
reason-is because regardless of race, color or creed, whether you have
an attorney, or you walk up, or a friend of yours sends you to see me,
or the district attorney or anything, the important thing is the
individual.
Mr. MILFORD. I understand that is the way you are looking at it, and
that is the way I would look at it, but-
Mr. AREVALO. Right, sir. And some of these cases have been cases
referred to me by attorneys who say, "Ted, I have a pr~blem. What
shall we do?"
PAGENO="0060"
56
In other cases people send them up to see me. Just citizens say, "Go
see Ted Arevalo, he is the chief of the section," and here is this man-
I have one right now referred to me by an individual who happened
to know me and this man does not have a. lawyer and he has a. prob-
lem-and I will tell you his problem: He has 10 kids; he is a. truck
driver, and this is about his second or third DWI-so this is another
case I am going to refer to the ASAP people.
And I told him, "Mister, bring your toothbrush because you are
going to the penitentiary the next time, if you get another one between
the time that I am trying to work it out."
Now, I do not know what I am going to do with this man, but I
handled that man with as much importance as the one who has a. law-
yer, whether it is high pay or whatever the situation is. a. court-
appointed attorney.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have a. real tough decision there, have you not?
Mr. AREVALO. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Here is a guy who makes his living, with 10 kids, by
being a truck driver. You can put him out of business. And you won-
der what is going to happen to those 10 kids. But then, on the other
hand, you get to thinking: "Here is a guy who has been drunk three
times driving, and if I do not do something dramatic, he is liable to
kill himself or somebody else, and then what is going to happen to his
kids and that somebody else's kids, too ?"
Mr. AREVALO. I told him-I appeared at. the motion and I talked to
him and I said, "You are going to kill me because. I am no different
than anybody else out in the street and I will not like that."
He is a real nice man, real fine, but he has a. problem, and maybe
there a.re other problems that are related to this thing. Where does he
live? Is this near where you have a lot of DWI's?
The San Antonio recreation system is fantastic. I was not as ac-
quainted as much with it as I am right now because my kids are
getting at that age-and they teach the children dancing and music
and other recreational matters free of charge, and maybe we need to
move some of these activities down in those areas where we do have
these DWI's. Maybe he needs to get his children away so he can drink
at home. [Laughter.]
I told him, I said, "Why not drink at. home ?" And maybe the reason
he will not drink at home is because he has 10 kids around the house
all the time-but these other activities can help out.
And each case is different, and I may make the wrong decision some-
times-after all, it is a matter of judgment. My attorneys will do the
same thing.
We treat everybody on an equal basis, regardless of age. sex, or
creed. We go out of our way-sometimes the judges get angry at us,
and sometimes we get angry at the judges, and I am sure the. two
judges present here toda.y will agree. I do not. agree with everything
they do, and they know it.. and they do not agree. with everything I do,
and I know it-but it is a. matter of cooperation between the law
enforcement agency, the judicial, and the district attorney's office. and
all the other agencies that help toward the building of that family-
you have a family of human beings, not just a typecast deal. So we
are doing the best we can.
Mr. LEVITAS. Mr. Chairman, I have one question, if I may.
PAGENO="0061"
57
Mr. WRKmT. Surely.
Mr. LEVITAS. Again by way of just some background information
on the legal situation, is it a requirement that a person arrested for
DWI, at the time of his arrest be advised of his Miranda rights?
Mr. AREVALO. Well, the law in the State of Texas is-and, of course,
one of the reasons that prompted this case under the Supreme Court
concerning the probable cause and so was the fact that this particular
State did not have basic protection for the citizens of the community.
The State of Texas does have a requirement that immediately-that
is not the word, "immediately"-what is the word? I cannot think of
the word in the statute-after arrest-forthwith after arrest he should
be taken before a magistrate and warned of his rights, and the rights
are there. But the court of appeals interpretation has been that unless
a violation of those rights leads to evidence which may convict an
individual, failure to give the rights is not-
Mr. LEVITAS. Let me give you an example of what I am talking about,
if Imay.
Mr. AREVALO. Right.
Mr. LEVITAS. An individual is arrested because he is weaving across
the center line and he is pulled to the side. The arresting officer-and
let me interject here. I was interested to know about tins check sheet
that you use here because it has been my experience-I used to defend
and prosecute some of these cases, and invariably, no matter who it
was that was charged, on the police reports that I saw, lie was always
required to be assisted from the car because he needed help; lie spoke
with slurred speech; and he was staggering, and the distinct odor of
alcohol was on his breath, as if it were a predetermined mimeographed
approach.
But, in any event, my question is that: When you get this type of
information on the police report, does it say that the person has al-
ready stated how much he has had to drink, where lie was, and
things of this sort and, if so, do you use this in connection with the
prosecution?
Mr. AREVALO. Now, here we get involved into that which is ad-
missible during the trail and that information which is considered-
which the officer receives from the party at the time that he is process-
in~ the individual.
The officer, at the time lie arrests the individual, to the best of my
knowledge, advises the subject concerning the breathalvzer~ which he
has the right to take the test and et cetera, et cetera. and he advises him
that he is going to get his driver's license-supposedly lie is capable
of getting his driver's license susnended if he does not take the test.
He may refuse if he wants to. Then you get involved in this other
legality of whether or not you can force him, but lie has-in the State
of Texas he has the choice once lie is advised what is going to happen
1f Lp refuses.
Now, in reference to the Miranda warning and the confession or any-
thing that may be admissible in the State of Texas, we get involved
in a group of decisions, numerous decisions from the court of anneals
and the 11.5. Supreme Court on the basis of the Miranda warning as
to what is admissible at the time-during the process of the arrest.
For example, the Court of Criminal Appeals has said that you can
throw the Miranda warning out the door, if you can qualify any
PAGENO="0062"
58
statements made by the defendant as res justae. That is admissible in
evidence.
Now, we do get information on the back of that report from the
highway patrol and the San Antonio police officers and which is used
by all the other law enforcement agencies-you have a space which
says, "Where are you coming from? What time is it? Did you have
so~nething to drink? How much did you have to drink? What did you
drink? Where do you work? Are you sick? Do you have any physical
deformities?" questions of that nature. All right. Those are answers
that are answered in there. .
Now, since it is not reduced to writ.mg-m the State of Texas in
order to be able to admit into evidence a so-called confessioii or state-.
ments made by the defendant, the basic rule is that-besides res
justae and the matters which are said in the iiivestigatory proceed-
~ng, not yet a defendant-the statements are not admissible unless
they go t~o the recovery of part of the corpus delecti, part of the of-
fense, like recovery of a weapon, recovery of a dress or something
like that.
So all these items which the subject is telling the police officer, al-
though he gives him the Miranda warning, is not. admissible because
it is not reduced to writing and the defendant does iiot sign it. In
Texas we do not have verbal confessions in comparison with other
States.
So, therefore, we do use it. We do use it for our case. In fact, we got
into a little discussion with one of the judges. WTe wanted to use it
to impeach the defendant because he haid said he had only-when he
took the stand I think he said he only had two beers when we were
trying the case; the officer in the field, he told him six, and we wanted
to use this to impeach the defeiidant and we got iiito a little argumeiit.
But we do use it to evaluate; we do use it to try the case, but as to
whether or not we can get it before the jury or before the court on the
trial on the merits is a different story. But all that information is help-
ful because it tells us where the guy is coming from, where. he. is going,
and if he takes the stand and tries to tell you that he was coming from
another place when he told the officer some place else, we may be able
to get an investigator to go check it out and show that his story i~
not the truth, so it could help us-it does; not could.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much.
Mr. MILFORD. Mr. Chairman, may I make one short observation?
Mr. WRIGHT. Surely.
Mr. MILF0RD. That is that the city of San Antonio should be very
proud to have a gentleman of this dedication iii the very sensitive and
often trying ]ob that lie has. I think it speaks well for the city in this
area.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, I think the whole committee would agree with
that. You have certainly benefited us and broadened our understandiiig
of the whole situation.
Mr. AREVALO. I would like to comment to the fact that Mr. ButlerS
the district attorney of Bexar County, is the man that supervises and
he knows everything that goes on in our misdemeanor section. We
check with him. He approves aiid we hash out those things that he
believes are not worthwhile. aiid he controls evervthing that we do.
so many of these ideas and thoughts are his own ideas and thoughts.
I put them to work.
PAGENO="0063"
59
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you, sir.
Mr. AREVALO. May I be excused?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes, sir.
Our next witnesses are members of the bench, the Hon. Judge Rose
Spector, judge, Bexar County, and the Hon. John W. Bell.
I wonder if the two of them might come forward and let us take
just a very brief little break, maybe 3 or 4 minutes, for the benefit of
the court reporter and others.
[A short recess was taken.]
Mr. WRIGHT. The committee will resume.
Judge Spector and Judge Bell, thank you for helping us to a clearer
understanding of this effort, and we are quite aware of the extremely
important part that each of you, as well as other judges, must play, and
we would like you to feel free to proceed in whatever fashion you
might deem most useful.
TESTIMONY 0]? HON. ROSE SPECTOR, JUDc+E, BEXAR COUNTY, AND
HON. JOHN W. BELL, JUDf+E, BEXAR COUNTY
Judge SPECTOR. I have a short statement.
I am Rose Spector, judge of county court at law No. 5 here in
Bexar County. I have served in that position since January 1 of this
year.
I would like to comment briefly on those aspects of ASAP with which
I am familiar, but in no way will attempt an overall assessment of the
program.
To date there have been approximately 500 DWI cases filed in Coun~
ty Court 5. Of that number approximately one-fifth have been reduced
to a public intoxication charge on the recommendation of the district
attorney. These were the cases that I believe you referred to as bypass.
In those cases where, however, the defendant has not been recom-
mended to the ASAP school and/or has not completed such classes,
the case proceeds to trial on the misdemeanor offense of driving while
intoxicated.
In Texas, when a defendant is found guilty of driving while intoxi-
cated, the minimum punishment required is a $50 fine plus a mandatory
3 days in jail. Therefore, most defendants will apply for probation so
that they will not, if convicted, be required to serve any jail time.
Our court procedure is at the time that the defendant is found guilty
the court requires a presentence evaluation. Ordinarily in misdemeanor
cases in the county courts our probation department is unable to pro-
vide a personal presentence interview with the defendant. It is only
through the evaluation provided by ASAP personnel in the DWI cases
that the court has available to it the results of a personal interview
before granting or denying probation. This. of course, is very helpful.
As you can see-I do not know if anyone has shown you one of these
this morning_-the evaluation contains a summary of the diagnosis, plus
usually one or two pages of typewritten matter on the background and
attitude of the defendant.
Mr. WRIGHT. I wonder if it would not be useful for us to insert into
the hearing record a copy of one of these documents. A blank copy is
fine. In any event, we would not want the names or identification of
the individuals.
PAGENO="0064"
60
AS~2
E~ES~EN1E~cE~ E~ILO~,
NAME COURT DOCKET NUMBER
COUNTY COURT NUMBER PROBATION HEARING DATE
EVALUATOR'S SUGGESTION:
SUMMARY OF DIAGNOSIS
REFER PROBATIONER TO ASAP FOR ENROLLMENT
10/75
Judge SPECTOR. Well, this is what we are referring to. This is an
evaluation prepared by ASAP. It does contain a summary of the
diagnosis, plus a recommendation.
This sheet contains a synopsis of the rehabilitation alternatives open
as a recommendation and it lists and details the types of modalities
that are recommended as a condition of probation.
You will notice, however, that nowhere on this synopsis or on the
recommendation is there a category marked as a control group, and
it is to this category that I would like to direct your attention.
It is my understanding that in seeking to determine what programs
are effective, you gentlemen, th~ Congress, require that control groups
be set up so that accurate results may be obtained. I find this method
PAGENO="0065"
61
of evaluation and assessment to be unacceptable in the administration
of justice.
If treatment and rehabilitation for those with drinking problems is
to be made a condition of probation, the absence of such treatment as
part of the control study, in my mind, is contrary to the law.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, let me-let the committee understand what you
have just said. Do I discern from your comment that there is some
deliberate attempt to create two separate groups simply for the purpose
of evaluating effects?
Judge SPECTOR. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. All right, now. This is new. Am I correct in deducing
that some are deliberately excluded from the treatment program?
Judge SPECTOR. Yes.
Mr. WRIGHT. And that this is dictated at the national level?
Judge SPECTOR. That is my understanding.
Mr. WRIGHT. What is the ostensible purpose? To find out if one type
treatment works?
Judge SPECTOR. Which treatments work and which are less success-
ful.
Mr. WRIGHT. This is making a guinea pig of an individual, is it not?
.Judge SPECTOR. Yes, sir. I am critical of that aspect of the program.
That is why I came over here.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, I am a bit surprised to discover that apparently
someone at the Federal level has insisted upon this kind of discrimina-
tory treatment.
If we presume that the ASAP program has been official in most
cases, tl1en to deny it to someone would be to afflict that individual with
an unfair treatment, it seems to me.
Judge SPECTOR. I would agree with you.
Mr. MILFORD. Mr. Chairman, do you want a comment?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes; I do.
Mr. MILFORD. I think the idea as set up here is that this is an experi-
mental program. We do not know whether ASAP works or not, and
the only way we can find out is on a comparative basis where you
do have to have a known and it has to be compared against the stand-
ard of the unknown. Otherwise~ no one has a way of evaluating. I un-
derstand it is a very difficult problem.
Judge SPECTOR. There is no question about it.
Mr. MILFORD. Nonetheless, the taxpayers get a little bit disturbed
when we spend millions of dollars unless we can go back and say: This
here is what we spent your dollars for and here is what we accom-
plished.
And, yet, there is no way of determining this unless you have some-
thing to compare it with; the norm being no controls at all, the factor
we are trying to find out is whether or not we can rehabilitate or
whether there is a better method.
It is a very difficult problem. I do not know that I know the answer,
and if you have it. we would certainly like to hear it.
Mr. LEVITAS. Well, Mr. Chairman-
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Levitas. .
Mr. LEVITAS [continuing.] If the gentleman will yield. It 1S interest-
ing-~I was just writing out a question that I was going to ask on this
very point, because there seems to me to be a difference between the
deliberate exclusion of a person from the system, on the one hand,
66-089 0 - 76 - 5
PAGENO="0066"
62
which is what Judge Spector has suggested occurs-I assume you do
not have a factual basis except just what you have heard for making
that statement, that there is a deliberate exclusion of people from the
ASAP program who want to get into it.
That is one situation. The other type of control that could exist are
those people who voluntarily exclude themselves from the ASAP
program, and I understand from previous testimony there are a num-
ber of people who are charged with DWI who are offered the oppor-
tunity of participation in ASAP but who do not choose to go into it.
Judge SPECTOR. Well, there are two different levels. If you are
charged with DWI, and assuming you meet the criteria enumerated
by Mr. Arevalo of the district attorney's office, the offer is made
that contingent upon your successfully completed ASAP, the charge
will probably be reduced or dismissed-usually reduced to a public
intoxication.
Now, at that point, as far as I know, everyone is treated the
same.
I am particularly concerned about the point where two individuals
have been found guilty of a crime. They are evaluated by a program
that is financed with Federal funds.
Mr. WRIGHT. These are situations where a conviction has already
been obtained?
Judge SPECTOR. Yes, sir. Both defendants have applied for proba-
tion; both records are identical-as identical as two records can be.
And one is put on probation with the condition that he perhaps
attend an alcoholic treatment program, an ATP. The second individ-
ual is also put on probation but it is recommended that he not attend
the alcoholic treatment program. This is done for purposes of evalua-
tion as to whether the alcohol treatment program is really helping
anyone.
Mr. LEVITAS. Who makes that recommendation, Judge?
Judge SPECTOR. Now, let me say that I have not followed the recom-
mendations in county court 5 and-
Mr. WRIGHT. The final determination is yours. is it not?
Judge SPECTOR. Well, the end result has been that a number of per-
sons-and I cannot give you the exact numbers, but I am sure that
someone from ASAP can-are being placed in a control group.
Mr. WRIGHT. A control group meaning those who attend the treat-
ment program?
Judge SPECTOR. Who are on probation but not receiving the pro-
grams that have been instituted for alcohol treatment.
Mr. WRIGHT. In what sense do we call it a control group, then? It
is not being controlled in the generic sense of that term.
Mr. MILFORD. Will the chairman yield?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes.
Mr. MILFORD. I think what it is. it is a group that the ASAF will
monitor and compare group A, those who have been rehabilitated~
with group B, those who have received no treatment~ and they will
follow these two groups to later surmise the value or what has hap-
pened with-
Mr. WRIGHT. There may be a value to this-
Mr. MILFORD. Yes; this is-
PAGENO="0067"
63
Mr. WRIGHT [continuing]. That I do not see, but it seems to me that
the variables which must exist from one individual to another would
make it necessary for a significantly large number to be evaluated in
each such group if we were to have any law of mathematical probabili-
ties to take place.
Now, I do not know-maybe some of these other witnesses can give
us information to that effect. Maybe Mr. Flores or others.
Mr. MYERS. Would the gentleman yield?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes, sir.
Mr. MYERS. On this point, Judge, on the evaluation of the program-
and I think I agree with Mr. Milford quite strongly that we do have to
have an evaluation program-your objection, as I understand it, is that
we are denying one group.
It would be my understanding we are not denying them-I think
my comments go in two directions-we are not denying them something
that had been available to them prior to this time, so that we are
handling them in very much the same way they would be, absent the
ASAP program, and that is what we are trying to eva~luate, what
ASAP means as compared to what we were offering before.
Second, I would ask you: Would you object to a process whereby
group A is given the ASAP program and group B is given 25 percent
of the ASAP program?
Judge SPECTOR. No, I think that is the same problem.
Mr. MYERS. The problem I `see is this: We have gone-from earlier
testimony-just from a concept and developed a program. Now, that
program I do not think should be regarded as being set in concrete and
being utopia. The fact of the matter is, it is one `of, what, now, 35
programs? There have been 35 programs and what we are trying to
do is find out what the best situation is, and perhaps we have 25 percent
excessive exposure to the participants right now; the program may be
good, except it is too long; the program may not be long enough, and
even evaluating backward-or let us take the program as it is now and
give them a more extensive program to compare it again, would you
object to that sort of a proposal?
Judge SPECTOR. Maybe I can make myself a little clearer. If you
liken this to a drug program and you were saying `half of the people
are going to get `drug A and `half of the people are not going to get
any drug; half are going to be on one drug, half are going to be on
another, I think you see the problem more clearly.
Mr. MILFORD. I believe this is exactly w'hat we are trying to do here.
Judge SPECTOR. I do not think it is proper when it gets into a sys-
tem of justice where the purpose is not to experiment.
Mr. WRIGHT. Medically, alcoholism hafls been compared with dia-
betes. There is a very low tolerance level in some individuals for sugar;
among other individuals there is an abnormally low tolerance level
for alcohol.
Would it be ethical for the medical profession arbitrarily to decide,
for example, that a control group of certain persons suffering from
diabetes would be given a certain drug and another group would not?
I am not aware whether this is done or not through the National
Academy of Science or something like that.
Mr. LEVITAS. Mr. Chairman, if you will yield for a moment. There
has recently been a rathe'r prominent news item. I do not want to corn-
PAGENO="0068"
64
pare the two exactly-but it is a common analogy. About 20 years ago
there was a syphilis treatment program being studied at Tuskegee In-
~titute and a certain number of the persons in the program were. placed
in a control group and were not given the drugs that were being tested
as far as the program and they developed all sorts of subsequent symp-
toms, and I believe this matter is now presently in litigation-and it
was a Federal program.
And I must agree with Judge Spector on this point. If a group of
people who desire to be placed in a program which would cure them
of repeated activity of the sort tha.t we are talking about, I think they
are being denied a right, if you will, that is being extended to others
who are receiving treatment.
Mr. WTRIGHT. Judge Bell, what is your observation on this divisive
subject? I see the committee is split 50-50. What is your experience?
Judge Bm~L. I am John W. Bell, and I do not agree with Judge
Spector in this case.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, the judiciary is split, too.
Judge BELL. In my particular court I do not exclude anyone from
any of the programs that are available, and I absolutely refuse to take
anyone's recommendation on any subjectS but reserve specifically the
right to look at each individual case on its own merits. I want all of
the recOmmendations I ca.n get.
In my court, county court at law No. 2, treatment is offered to
every person who is granted probation.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, now, has anyone suggested to you that this
should not be the case?
Judge BELL. No, sir. it is offered and I trust that at least in most
cases I have enough wisdom where a recommendation that I do not
agree with, that my order is at least as good as that recommendation
or better.
1~\Then I get a recommendation for a control group and a particular
defendant is before the bench, I make it a. point to offer him that pro-
gram which I think will be most appropriate and discuss it with him.
I have had some defendants in individual cases that. said. "I want
the program," and they are assigned to it, whether it be. ATP or any
one of the schools that they have-they have a. number of programs
that are keyed to individual needs, depending on whether you are a
problem drinker or a social drinker, what your problem is.
In most instances-I would say in over 95 percent of the individuals
that have come to me with a. recommendation as being a member of
the control group, that is, a person that they have, arbitrarily selected
to put in that group to chec.k and to follow through on to see how they
compare with the person that is receiving treatment that they have
categorized in the same general category-
Mr. WRIGHT. Let me ask a. question a.t this point, which seems to go
to the heart of the issue: To your knowledge and that of Judge Spec-
tor, has any DWI request for treatment ever been refused?
Judge BELL. No, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. In the ASAP program?
Judge BELL. No, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Are you aware of any, Judge Spector?
Judge SPECTOR. Well, in the legal right, sometimes your wa.iver
is not a knowing, voluntary waiver, and you recognize that the people
PAGENO="0069"
65
we are talking about have been charged in the criminal sense and, in
most cases, convicted in the criminal sense, and I would hesitate to
say that they have voluntarily decided not to seek treatnlent.
Mr. WRIGHT. Perhaps the option for treatment simply has not been
offered to them?
Judge SPECTOR. They might not recogmze that they do in fact have
an option.
Judge BELL. Might I say something there?
Mr~ WRIGHT. Indeed.
Judge BELL. I think "desire" is the key word. You brought up a
while ago the discussion of some `drugs. Do you suggest that it would
be ethical to require that every diabetic take a particular drug because
somebody thought it would be beneficial to them?
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, that is an interesting corollary to the question I
asked.
Judge BELL. Is is something that I am not real sure of. It is an
area that we have a lot to learn about. As far as I am concerned, I
think "desire" is the key word, and I think that each individual case
must be looked upon specifically and in as much detail as is necessary
regardless of how crowded the docket is or how many lawyers and their
clients are waiting to be heard. I am going to take whatever time I
think is necessary to be convinced in my own mind that this person is
knowingly waiving his rights to a trial by a jury, his right to be repre-
sented by an attorney, his right to have witnesses brought into court
and confront him, his right to get as much treatment as the law makes
available for him.
But if he waives those rights, I am going to go ahead and find him
guilty and sentence him and make my own decision about what the
terms and conditions of his probation are going to be~ and I refuse to be
required to folow the guidelines set up by the adult or misdemeanor
probation section.
In other words, quite frequently they will recommend against pro-
bation, and I have granted probation, and will continue to do so.
Mr. WRIGHT. Let me ask this related questionS In instan~es where
you have granted probation conditional upon the offender's attending
a certain number of classes, for example, is there a systematic means
by which you are advised of the failure of that individual to fulfill
the terms of his probation?
Judge BELL. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. You are satisfied that you are advised in all such
instances?
Judge BELL. By at least three different agencies.
Mr. WRIGHT. I see. And is that the case in your instance, too, Judge
Spector?
Judge SPECTOR. Since we have only been in that court 7 months and
most probations would be a minimum of 6 months, the problem is just
beginning to surface.
Mr. MYERS. Will the gentleman yield?
Mr. WRIGHT. Congressman Myers.
Mr. MYERS. I think this point is extremely important and one of the
reasons why we are here, evaluation.
Now, it would seem to me that the court's basic need would be an
evaluation of the program. I would think that the court would have to
PAGENO="0070"
66
be convinced that assignment to the ASAP program was an asset and
that asset was documented by some scientific foundation.
Now, perhaps we are no even on the right program. Perhaps the pro-
gram is not intensive enough. Perhaps in some cases, it would be my
opinion, that it may even be harmful to someone. And those are the
evaluations we are trying to make and, although I do not like to oppose
a statement of my colleague, I would like to point out that, if my
recollection is correct, on the syphilis case mentioned by Congressman
Levitas that it was an experiment, an evaluation of a treatment, and
it is my opinion that it just so happened that the litigation is on one
side of that issue.
Perhaps 20 years or later the litigation could have been in the case
of those who were given the treatment rather than those who were
denied the treatment because the treatment was inherently bad for
the patients.
However, if, in the cast of the syphilis situation. we lmew that there
was a treatment that was beneficial to the patients and we intention-
ally denied that to them, that would be the other case, and that is
clearly what we are trying to decide here-how in the world do you
evaluate whether $2 million means anything and how in the world do
we evaluate to the point that, if it is meaningful, we convince the com-
munities to continue to fund it?
I would think that if we are doing nothing more than giving the
same option that you have given in the past, and will give in the fu-
ture if the program is no longer funded, as one of the alternatives it is
not just a bad alternative. Perhaps, if it is offensive to the court.. maybe
what we should do in our evaluation program is do half of what we are
doing today or do twice as much-half as much for one group and half
of what we are doing for another group.
But I would think that comparison and evaluation is really the
meat of what we are out here for today.
Judge SPECTOR. I might just point out one thing: I suggested to
some of the personnel of ASAP that perhaps to-I realize it is neces-
sary and I appreciate the Congressman's feelings that the public likes
to feel that these programs are worthwhile-but my suggestion was
that they wait until all legal sanctions had been completed and then
start some type of evaluation program. In other words, wait until the
man has been convicted and not received probation and served his
jail time; if he has received probation, wait until the probation has
been completed; begin at that point to evaluate. The reply was we
would not have any volunteers at that point, and that is my objec-
tion. This is not-in a courtroom situation, that is not a volunteer
who is volunteering to participate in this program. That is my
objection.
Mr. WRIGHT. I am wondering if it would be possible for purposes
of comparative evaluation to create a retroactive control group com-
posed of those people who were convicted prior to the inauguration
of the ASAP program and an attempt made to follow through upon
their subsequent histories.
I do not know that we, among us. could come to any hard and fast
conclusion on this, but it seems to have elements of public disputes
that surround many things, including the fluoridation of city water.
for example, and the legal requirement that every child in school
PAGENO="0071"
67
be vaccinated for smallpox, and some people objected conscientiously
to both of those legal requirements.
But I think, in focusing upon this immediate problem, Judge Bell
may have put his finger upon a truly significant factor when he said
that "desire" is a key word, more so than in any of these comparable
situations.
Desire may not be absolutely essential to one's protecting his teeth
from cavities. If he gets fluoridation in his water whether he desires
to protect himself from cavities or not is less significant, it seems to
me-and the desire of a person not to get smallpox probably is quite
considerably less significant in the probability of his remaining whole
than it is in the case of the problem drinker.
In the instance of a problem drinker, absent desire, I should think
no treatment could be very effective.
Would you comment on that? Do you agree fundamentally with
that premise?
Judge BELL. No, sir; I do not. I do not think the problem drinker
even recognizes he is a problem drinker, in my personal experience in
a great many specific instances.
Mr. WIIIOHT. Well, is that not the problem?
Judge BELL. That is the first problem, so you have to create the
desire in him. If you took a poll of the members of the Bexar County
jail this afternoon, every one of them over there would swear on a
stack of Bibles that he would never do it again, whatever crime he is
accused of, and he would do most anything to get out of there and
promise you anything this afternoon. And we have that specific prob-
lem in our courtrooms.
Mr. WRIGHT. He does not desire to quit drinking, though, does he?
Judge BELL. He will tell you whatever he thinks you want to hear or
see; will make any statement they think you, as the judge, want to
hear. So you have to guard against that and you have to satisfy your-
self-or at least let me put it this way: I feel that I must delve into
the problem to satisfy myself that they are not under any pressure;
that they are not desiring this treatment because they think I want
them to desire it; or that they are not refusing it because they think
I think they should refuse it.
I try to stay neutral and make it as objective an offer as possible.
I know Judge Spector disagrees with me, and she may be right. I
am simply stating to you my position, and I obviously think I am
right on it.
If I could just make a general statement, it might open the door for
a few questions. I feel, personally, that the alcohol safety action proj-
ect is a failure if you are looking to make alcohol safe. I do not think
i.t is safe at all in Bexar County, and I do not think that they have
done anything but maybe get a little toehold in trying to solve the
problems that we are faced with.
But in spite of that feeling that the alcohol safety action project is
a failure, it is my opinion it is fully worth the considerable expense
that the taxpayers and the Nation and the local citizens have gone to,
and that I, personally, appreciate the help I have received in evalu-
ating the specific problems of specific individuals-and obviously I
want the two reports back that I have given you examples of, but I
did think you ought to see some specific examples of the type help
that I get.
PAGENO="0072"
68
I look at those reports with great interest. I also get reports as to
what the previous arrest records are and everything else and try to
use all of the information that is made available to me in arriving at a
decision, and I do think that the ASAP program has at least helped
us in looking at available programs.
In other words, ASAP, to me, is not just the alcohol safety action
project but the coordination that they have provided through the
Bexar County adult probation office with the other agencies such as
CARP, the alcohol treatment project, and many others, and my expe-
rience with them has been-and I think if you will notice in this one
example that I gave you, they recommended PMT and ATP. They
are not under their programs at all, but other-I think they are fed-
erally funded, also, or at least in part federally funded.
So I, personally, feel in my experience as a judge, but more so in
my experience as a practicing attorney in Bexar County defending
people charged with DWI~and some of them I would not take their
Programs and some of them I did, depending on the specific. file I had-
but I hope that we can continue the ASAP program and can improve
on the programs that they coordinate.
It appears to me that they are cooperating with other agencies in
trying to upgrade the services you get in them. I think they are a big
help in the identification of the problem, that is, is he a. social drinker
or is he a problem drinker.
There are specific instances that I think they just missed the boat
and made a miscalculation, but I appreciate their giving me both an
evaluation, a summary of it, but then giving me some information
about how they got to that evaluation so that I may agree or disagree
with it.
In any event, I know-and do not get me wrong-that judges may
disagree. I do disagree with Judge Spector on this particular point.
But I can assure you that all of the judges of the county courts at law
of Bexar County are unanimous in agreeing that they want to improve
the judicial system in Bexar County, and in keeping with this attitude
they have initiated steps that have tried to improve the availability
and the accuracy of the information that we get. Part. of it is through
the alcohol safety action project a.nd part of it is through other means,
and we are trying to find means of using the automated techniques and
the modern technology that is available in court management and court
docket control and in finding effective alternatives to traditional
punishment, that is, confinement and a. fine.
And I think ASAP and the ATP program and particularly the
adult probation office of Bexar County are to be commended. I was
not aware of the full efforts of these groups to the extent that I am
now a year ago, and in my opinion they are cooperating a. lot more.
I think there is a lot more to be done, by the way, and I hope we
will meet and try to get improvements made.
I, personally, feel that the legal aid system of releasing people on
their personal bond would more appropriately be handled by the pro-
bation office and the file initiated, but that is just one specific. improve-
ment I, personally, see. I have got to sell the other judges on it~ then
the Commissioners' Court, and then the probation office, legal aid, and
possibly the Congressmen that handle the committee, but there are
many projects like this that we, as county court judges, are attempting
to inaugurate, so do not leave with the impression that because Judge
PAGENO="0073"
69
Spector and I disagree on how we should go about a control group that
there is any rea.l disagreement. I feel, personally, there is none, even
though I did say initially that I do disagree with them-you under-
stand the point I am trying to make.
Mr. WRIGHT. I think I understand the point you are trying to make.
Mr. MILFORD. There is just one thing, though, that bothers me a
little bit here. We have spent so far $86 million in the ASAP program
and it is an experimental program. It is designed to find out something,
find out whether this works, and at some point in time we are going
to have to go back to the Congress and render a. report-or we are
going to have to go back to the American public and render an
accounting.
"We have spent 86 million of your dollars. Here is what we have
proved."
And it has to be done on a scientific basis. I realize this creates
problems within the legal world but, yet, if we do not or if we are
unable to go back and say scientifically, "Yet, this program will cut
alcoholism or will help," without `that we have lost everything. We
have spent $86 million for nc~thing; we have not been able to prove
anything-so that the cooperation within these programs is very
important.
Judge BELL. That is why I have cooperated as much as I possibly
can.
Mr. MILFORD. I do not know; I am not smart enough to give an
alternative ~ns'xer on how it can be done but, yet., it must be done
some way.
Judge BELL. That is why I, personally, feel like I want to do every-
thing that I can, and I feel like the control group, although I do not
have `the statistics-I am personally convinced that over 95 or 96 per-
cent of the people who h'ave been recommended to me to go into control
groups went in there, but I am also personally satisfied that I have
not abridged anyone's rights in any specific instance because I have
offered them the possibility of treatment, and I am personally con-
vinced that those to whom I offered that treatment were knowingly
declining to accept it.
Mr. MILFORD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. Are there other questions?
Mr. MYERS. Just on the need for evaluation, we have seen-we have
had testimony today that alluded to t.he fact that the program was
successful because the `arrests in this area went up on an average of
1,000 to an average of 318 percent. Now, that was one of the arguments
for success of the program.
Now, in 1974 it trailed off, and that also by one witness said to be
a measure of success.
Now, in order to-I do not think that any of those figures can
really be used to evaluate `the program, because if you went back to
1,000 you could have all kinds of combinations of factors involved to
get you back down there, and you could just say that it was a
failure, where in fact `it may `have been a success.
And this is the only thing I am saying, that the evaluation program,
we cannot just take the statistics we have compiled altogether. I think
even the group that we get to which we offer `the ASAP program is
necessarily a group in itself and distinct, so that you cannot compare
those with the ones that did not voluntarily go for the ASAP pro-
66-089 0 - 76 - 6
PAGENO="0074"
70
gram and went the other way. There were reasons why these people
went to the program and it should help them. It might be very difficult
to correlate their results with others.
Judge BELL. It is my understanding that they are being excluded
for that reason.
Mr. MYERS. So these are the reasons why we are looking for, as
Mr. Milford said, a. way to convince someone that. the program can or
will work.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. WRIGHT. If there are not any additional questions, we want to
express to you, both of you-Judge Spector and Judge Bell-our
real appreciation for the time you have spent today helping us to
gain an understanding of this problem.
Judge SPECTOR. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. Arthur A. Flores is the chief evaluation specialist for
the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center and is a foca.l point for much
that is happening in this program, and we welcome you to t:he commit.-
tee, Mr. Flores, and will listen very attentively to what. information
you can give us. The full text of your prepared statement will appear
in the record at this point.
[Statement referred to follows:]
STATEMENT OF ARTHUR A. FLORES, CHIEF EVALUATION SPECIALIST, PROBLEM
DRINKER EVALUATION CENTER, SAN ANTONIO ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT
DESCRIPTION: PROBLEM DRINKER EVALUATION CENTER
The Problem Drinker Evaluation Center of the Alcohol Safety Action Project
is fundamentally a diagnostic and evaluation center which has six critical
functions.
First. As a diagnostic center, it provides the Bexar County Courts and the
District Attorney's Office with information concerning the DWI client's present
drinking behavior. That is, through the use of the Mortimer-Filkins Test, which
will be described later in this statement, the assistant evaluation specialists who
conduct the testing can accurately categorize DWI clients as either social drink-
ers, borderline problem drinkers, problem drinkers and alcoholics. In addition
to providing drinker status information the assistant evaluation specialists
through their written psycho-social evaluations provide the County Court judges
and the District Attorney's Office with the reason or reasons for the client's
abusive drinking behavior.
Second. The evaluation specialists in their psycho-social evaluations also fur-
nish the courts and the District Attorney w-ith rehabilitation options as a condi-
tion of possible probation or reduced charge.
Third. Between now and June 1977 the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center
will be involved in an intensive client and treatment follow-up program. This
follow-up program, which will be fully discussed during the course of this state-
ment, is an attempt to assess and determine if treatment is effective, if it pro-
motes client progress, and if certain types of treatment modalities are more effec-
tive for certain types, i.e. personality types, of clients.
Fourth. The Problem Drinker Evaluation Center serves as the referral and
coordination center for the community treatment agencies to which DWI clients
are referred. When release forms have been signed by the client, the evaluation
center can provide the treatment agency with vital background and treatment
information on the DWI client. This information gives the treatment agency a
headstart in their efforts to help the client. Through the center's coordination
efforts attendance/non-attendance, compliance/non-compliance information is
passed on to the Bexar County Adult Probation Office.
Fifth. The Evaluation Center serves the DWI client by giving him the oppor-
tunity to discuss his DWI arrest and drinking behavior in a non-punitive. non-
threatening, and confidential atmosphere. The client is encouraged to communi-
cate openly and to discuss his drinking behavior or any other significant life
problem that may be of concern to him or her at the time. The evaluation center
strives to promote an atmosphere of concern, involvement, and honesty.
PAGENO="0075"
71
Finally, the evaluation center provides the ASAP project evaluators with
statistical data and information which is used to assess and evaluate the overall
progress of the program.
The above was intended as a brief description and overview of the more criti-
cal functions of how the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center ties in with the
DWI client, the District Attorney's Office, the County Courts, and the Adult Pro-
bation Office.
The DWI evaluation effort begins with the referral of a DWI client from either
the County Courts or the District Attorney's Office. A referral from the County
Court is made by the judge when he is considering placing the DWI client on
probation. The referral from the District Attorney is made when a reduced
charge of public intoxication is being considered.
Once the DWI client reports to the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center the
evaluation effort begins with the administration of the Mortimer-Filkins Test
and the collection of the client's Breathalyzer results, plus his driving and ar-
rest records. The Mortimer-Filkins Test is comprised of a questionnaire and a
structured interview. The questionnaire is self-administered, consists of 58 ques-
tions, and takes five to ten minutes to complete. It is followed by the interview
between the assistant evaluation specialist and the DWI client. Depending upon
the client the interview may take thirty to forty-five minutes. Subject areas cov-
ered by the interview include physical health, previous arrest and driving his-
tory, drinking behavior and history, marital, family and work history. Once
the questionnaire and personal interview have been completed the Mortimer
Test is scored. The scoring keys show those responses which are expected to be
given by an individual with a drinking problem.
The scores of the questionnaire and interview are interpreted in the follow-
ing manner: problem drinker-85 points or more; borderline problem drinker-
more than 00 points but less than 85 points; and social drinker 60 points or less.
In cases of borderline problem drinkers considerations such as age, breath-
alyzer results, driving and criminal record, and behavior during the interview
make the difference between categorizing a client as a problem drinker or social
drinker.
The rehabilitation modality recommended for a county court or District
Attorney referral depends upon his problem drinker evaluation. At the pres-
ent time the Alcohol Safety Action Project is involved in a very intensive Short
Term Rehabilitation (STR) study, the purpose of which is to determine if treat-
ment is effective; if treatment promotes client progress and positive personality
changes; and if certain types of treatment modalities are more effective for cer-
tain types of clients. This Short Term Rehabilitation Study will be conducted
as follows:
At the end of the testing and interview session the DWI client is informed
about the Short Term Rehabilitation Study that the project is attempting to con-
duct. The study is fully explained and all of the client's questions are answered.
Once the client has an understanding of the study and its objectives he is then
asked if he wishes to volunteer to take part in the Short Term Rehabilitation
Study.
If the client volunteers to take part in the study he is then randomly assigned
to a treatment group appropriate to his drinker catq~gory or to its respective
minimum exposure group. If the client refuses to participate he is then asked
if he has an appropriate treatment preference in mind and if so he is assigned
to that treatment modality and excluded from the study. If the client has no
appropriate treatment preference or wishes to receive no treatment at all he is
then informed that a random treatment assignment will be made. The following
examples may serve to clarify the above mentioned procedure.
If, as a result of the testing and interview session, the DWI client is con-
sidered a social drinker and volunteers to participate in the study he will be
randomly assigned to either the ASAP Alcohol Information and Driver Educa-
ton (AIDE) School or its respective minimum exposure group. If this social
drinker chooses not to participate in the study but wishes to attend the AIDE
school this recommendation is made to the judge or the district attorney and
the client is excluded from the study. If the client refuses to participate in the
study and has no treatment preference he is then dandomly assigned to either
the AIDE School or its respective minimum exposure group.
If the client is categorized as a borderline or problem drinker and volunteers
to participate in the study he will be randomly assigned to either the Alcoholic
Treatment Program, or the Alcoholic Treatment Program plus Power Mottva-
tion Training or to a minimum exposure group.
PAGENO="0076"
72
If ths client chooses not to participate in the study but wishes to attend either
the Alcoholic Treatment Program or Power Motivation Training, or both, his
request is made known to the judge and the client is excluded from the study.
However, if this client has not treatment preference, and makes no selection he
is then randomly assigned to one of the above named treatment modalities or its
minmum exposure groups.
If an individual is considered an alcoholic he is automativally excluded from
the study and an appropriate treatment recommendation is made.
In addition to the random selection procedure described the Short Term Re-
habilitation Study will require that a Life Activities Inventory (LAI) be con-
ducted prior to or immediately after the client has entered his treatment o~
minimum exposure group. After the initial Life Activities Inventory three more
will be scheduled at six month intervals within an 18 month period. The LA1
sessions will be conducted only on the borderline and problem drinkers that have
been assigned and only on a total of 300 clients. The purpose of the LAI sessions
are to assess treatment effectiveness and to measure positive personality changes
as a result of having received treatment or not having received treatment.
Both the Mortimer-Filkins testing and interviewing sessions and the Life
Actviities Invèntovy sessions will be conducted by the assistant evaluation
specialists of the ASAP Problem Drinker Evaluation staff. At the present time
the Problem Drinker Evaluation Center is headed by an evaluation specialist
with a staff of three assistant evaluation specialists. At the present time the
evaluation center is lacking two additional assistant evaluation specialists but
expects to hire this personnel relatively soon.
I am the Evaluation Specialist responsible for the operation of the Problem
Drinker Evaluation Center. I have a BA. degree in English and History with a
minor in Education from St. Mary's University. I also have a Master's degree in
Psychology and Guidance from Our Lady of the Lake College and am bilingual
in English and Spanish.
The three assistant evaluation specialists are Mrs. Julia Hoyt. Mr. Leo Esparza
and Mr. Henry Gonzales.
Mrs. Hoyt has a B.A. degree from Our Lady of the Lake College in Psychology
with a minor in Social Welfare. She also has her Master's from Our Lady of the
Lage College in Psychology and Guidance and is bilingual in English and Spanish.
Mrs. Hoyt was with ASAP in the past under contract with the University of Texas
Medical School. She functioned as a Social Worker for the project and has gained
valuable knowledge and expertise which serves the project well.
Mr. Esparza earned his B.A. degree in Political Science with a minor in So-
ciology from Texas A&I University. He is presently working on his Master's
degree in Political Institutions and Administration and has done his graduate
work at Texas A&I University and St. Mary's University. Mr. Esparza is also
bilingmtl in English and Spanish.
Mr. Henry Gonzales earned his BA. degree in Sociology with a minor in
Psychology from Our Lady of the Lake College. Mr. Gonzales is also working
on his Master's degree in Psychology and Guidance at Our Lady of the Lake
College. Mr. Gonzales is also bilingual in English and Spanish.
The ASAP project is very pleased to have such well educated and well trained
individuals. Because of the sensitivity and nature of the work and because of the
clientele served, their psychology and socioloeical background, including their
bilingual ability, is considered an absolute requirement and asset in the per-
formance of their jobs.
Overall it is felt that the services furnished by the Evaluation Center and
the assistant evaluation specialists provide the judges with very useful infor-
mation that each judge uses in adjudicating each individual DWI case. These
services, prior to ASAP, were never provided by any county agency, including
the Bexar County Adult Probation Office. At the present time the ASAP Problem
Drinker Evaluation Center is, in our opinion, still the only office which, through
its testing, interviewing, and reporting procedures, can provide the judges with
professional services at such a sophisticated level.
POWER MOTIVATION TRAINING (PMT)
In addition to having the responsibility for the operation of the Problem
Drinker Evaluation Center I am also responsible for the coordination and irn-
plementjon of the Power Motivation Training Workshops. I ani a Power Motiva-
tion Therapist and received my training in October and November of 1Q73 and
my certification in April of 1974.
PAGENO="0077"
73
Power Motivation Training is a short-term group therapy module intended to
help a person examine his behavior and build skills which expands his choices
in life; skills which will allow him to develop satisfying alternatives to past
and present behavior. It is a pragmatic therapy, designed to be part of a total
treatment program. The program is based on the research work of Dr. David C.
McClelland, Dr. Ric Boyatzis, their colleagues, and the staff of 1\IcBer and Com-
pany.
The basic theoretical position upon which PMT is based is that men drink
alcoholic beverages in order to compensate for or overcome feelings of "power-
lessness" i.e., depression, boredom, tension, frustration, anxiety, fear, appre-
hension, loneliness, feelings of incompetence, uselessness, ineffectiveness, etc.
Put another way, men drink alcoholic beverages to attain, or regain, a feeling
of strength. Thoughts about being big, strong, important, influential, about
having more impact on others, about dominating others are all examples of
power concerns.
What PMT strives to accomplish is to help people have more freedom of choice
over their behavior and more ability to determine the results of what happens
to thqm, thereby improving their lives. An individual's freedom of choice is in-
creased when he recognizes how he behaves, understands the dynamics of why
he acts in that manner, and learns some alternatives.
This is done by helping the individual develop risk-assessment skills, goal-
setting skills, relaxation techniques, conflict-resolution techniques, interpersonal
relationship skills, mood assessment skills, and self-examination techniques.
The Power Motivation Training Workshop does not tell people to stop drink-
ing, not to stop competing, nor to stop arguing; it asks them to be aware of
the costs and benefits to themselves and others of any behavior which they
choose. Participation in such a program must be voluntary, and potential changes
in a person's life as a result of participation in the workshop must also be made
voluntarily.
Since PMT is a new treatment approach very little data as to its effectiveness
or success has been compiled. However, this data shall be forthcoming at the end
of the Short-Term Rehabilitation Study previously mentioned.
Of 100 cases taken at random from our case files of clients seen April 1, 1975
and June 30, 1975, the following DWI profile was developed.
The average age was 37 years with a range of 17 to 75 years. Ninety-five percent
were male, of whom 58 percent were married. The total number of years of formal
education of the group averaged sixth grade. Seventy-eight percent were gainfully
employed with an annual income ranging from $4,000 to $7,000 with an average
income of $G,150.
Seventy-eight percent of the one-hundred group used beer as their primary
intoxicant. The blood alcohol level (BAL) at the time of arrest ranged from
0.10% (the "legally drunk" level in Texas) to 0.34%, with an average for the
group of 0.19%. Police records of the offenders studied revealed that ninety-five
percent had received at least one previous arrest for an alcohol-related offense
and the average number of arrests was 4.2 with a range of 0 to 47.
TESTIMONY OF ARTHUR A. FLORES, CHIEF EVALUATION SPECIAL-
IST, PROBLEM DRINKER EVALUATION CENTER, SAN ANTONIO
ALCOHOL SAFETY ACTION PROJECT
Mr. FLORES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the welcome,
and I want to welcome you to San Antonio, and the distinguished
Members, also.
This is going to be kind of a hard act to follow. I do not know really
where to start, except to maybe initially try and clarify some of the
concepts-or some of the things that the problem drinker evaluation
center is trying to accomplish in its evaluations and its followup inter~
views, things of that nature.
To begin with, the problem drinker evaluation center is funda-
mentally a diagnostic and evaluation center and, as I see it, has several
critical functions-very valuable functions.
PAGENO="0078"
74
First of all, as a diagnostic center, I believe it provides the Bexar
County courts and the district attorney's office with information con-
cerning the individual DWI client's present drinking behavior, and
this is provided through the use of the Mortimer-Filkins test that the
evaluation specialists use when they conduct their presentence investi-
gations prior to the individual returning to court for sentencing.
I believe that is accomplished with the use of the individual's arrest
record-we get a lot of valuable information from that. and this, of
course, is passed on by the evaluation specialist to the judge and to the
probation office in their psycho-social evaluations. These are prepared
after each individual review and is provided to the judge-
Mr. MILFORD. Mr. Chairman, could we have the gentleman at this
point insert into the record the questionnaire of that test, a copy of
it?
Mr. FLORES. We can supply you with that.
Mr. WRIGHT. By all means.
Without objection, that document will appear at this point in the
record.
[The questionnaire referred to follows:]
PAGENO="0079"
75
Name
Appendix A
QUESTIONNAIRE (FORM A)
INSTRUCTIONS. Before you begin, please print your name at
the top of this page.
Please answer every question. Do not spend too much time on
any one question. We would like your first impressions, so try to
answer with the first thing that comes to mind. Answer each
question in the order in which it appears. Mark an "X" or check
(~/) for the TRUE (yes) /FALSE (no) questions. Where you are
asked to answer with a number, please put the number in the space
provided. If the event never happened to you, mark zero (0). If
the event truly does not apply to you draw a line through the
answer spaces. There are no right or wrong answers. Give the
answer which seems most correct to you. Are there any questions
now?
Go to the next page and begin.
PAGENO="0080"
76
Appendix A
QUESTIONNAIRE IFOR OFFICE USE ONLY
FORMA I
CASE ID ~_____________
j~TE
1. What is your present marital status?
1. single
2. separated
3. divorced
4. widowed
5. married
Enter number here (~ ) 1
2. With whom do you live?
1. alone
2. with friend(s)
3. with relative(s)
4. with wife(husband)
5. with ex-wife(ex-husband)
Enter number here (# ) 2
IF YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN MARRIED SKIP TO QUESTION NUMBER 6 TRUE FALSE
(yes) (no)
3. How many times have you and your wife (husband)
seriously considered divorce in the last two years? ) 3
4. Does (did) your wife (husband) often threaten you
with divorce? ( ) ( ) 4
5. Would you say that your wife's (husband's)
general health is (was) very good? ( ) ( ) 5
6. Are you employed now? ( ) ( ) 6
7. Do you smoke? ( ) ( ) 7
8. About how many packs of cigarettes do you smoke per
week? ) 8
9. Were you ever arrested? ( ) ( ) 9
PAGENO="0081"
77
Appendix A
TRUE FALSE
(yes) (no)
10. Are your relatives upset with the way you live? ( ) ( ) 10
11. Is your income sufficient for your basic needs? ( ) ( ) 11
12. Are you bothei~ed by nervousness (irritable, fidgety or
tense)? ( ) ( ) 12
13. My judgment is better than it ever was ( ) ( ) 13
14. Have you recently undergone a great stress (such as
something concerning your job, your health, your
finances, your family, or a loved one)? ( ) ( ) 14
15. I am apt to take disappointments so badly that I can't
put them out of my mind ( ) ) 15
16. I have long periods of such great restlessness that I
cannot sit long in a chair ( ) ( ) 16
17. Are you often sad or down in the dumps? ( ) ( ) 17
18. I have had periods in which I carried on activities
without knowing later what I had been doing ( ) ( ) 18
19. Do you have a lot of worries? ( ) ( ) 19
20. I have trouble sleeping ( ) ( ) 20
21. I am moderate in all my habits ( ) ( ) 21
22. Do you feel that you have abnormal problems? ( ) ( ) 22
23. I have lived the right kind of life ( ) ( ) 23
24. My home life is as happy as it should be ( ) ( ) 24
25. Does drinking help you make friends? ( ) ( ) 25
26. Much of the time I feel as if I have done something
wrong or evil ( ) ( ) 26
27. Do you think that creditors are much too quick to
bother you for payments? ( ) ( ) 27
28. I wish I could be as happy as others seem to be ( ) ( ) 28
29. I sometimes feel that I am about to go to pieces ( ) ( ) 29
30. Do you usually perspire at night? ( ) ( ) 30
31. I often feel uncomfortable and down in the dumps ( ) ( ) 31
32. About how many years has it been since your last
out-of-town vacation? (# ) 32
33. I am a high-strung person ( ) ( ) 33
34. I am satisfied with the way I live ( ) ( ) 34
PAGENO="0082"
78
Appendix A
TRUE FALSE
(yes) (no)
35. Have you ever had your drivers license suspended
or revoked? ) ( ) ~
36. About how many times have you asked for help for your
problems (personal, family, marriage, money, or
emotional)? ) 36
37. Is there a history of alcoholism in your family? ( ) ( ) 37
38. Do you have a relative who is an excessive drinker? ( ) ( ) 38
39. Are you often depressed and moody? ( ) ( ) 39
40. I often feel as if I were not myself ( ) ( ) 40
41. I am often afraid I will not be able to sleep ( ) ( ) 41
42. Do you often feel afraid to face the future? ( ) ( ) 42
43. Drinking seems to ease personal problems ( ) ( ) 43
44. How many drinks can you handle and still drive well? ( 4 ) 44
45. In the last year, how many times have you drunk more
than you could handle, but still been a good driver
when you got behind the wheel? (4 ) 45
46. I wish people would stop telling me how to live my life---( ) ( ) 46
47. I often am afraid without knowing why I am afraid ( ) ( ) 47
48. At times I think I am no good at all ( ) ( ) 48
49. Do you feel sinful or immoral? ( ) ( ) 49
50. A drink or two gives me energy to get started ( ) ( ) 50
51. Does drinking help you work better? ( ) ( ) 51
52. My daily life is full of things that keep me interested--- ( ) ( ) 52
53. I often have feelings of vague restlessness ( ) C ) 53
54. My friends are much happier than I am C ) C ) 54
55. I often pity myself C ) C ) ~
56. Would you say that 4 or 5 drinks affect your driving? C ) ( ) 56
57. I feel tense and anxious most of the time ( ) C ) 57
58. Are you often bored and restless? C ) C ) 58
PAGENO="0083"
79
CASE INFORMATION SHEET
Agency ID# 105 Case ID~ 120 Date 126
Mo. /Day/Yr.
Name
Last First Middle or Maiden
Address
Number Street City Zip Code
Telepuone_____________ Driver's License No. 142
Sex______ 143 Nationality or Race 144 Age 146 Weight 149
(M=1, ~2) (White~1, Black=2, Other=3)
Date of Birth 155 Attending DWI Class? Y N 156
Mo ./Day/Yr.
Number of class sessions completed 157 Instructor ID# 159
Marital Status 160 Occupation 162
(Sgl.l, Sep.=2, Div.=3,
Wid.=4, Marr.=5)
Interviewer 1D4( 164 Number of interviews
previously conducted by this interviewer 167
Interviewer's title
Circumstances of Contact 168
1. Pre-sentence investigation
2. Condition of probation
3. Other (specify) _______________________
Referral Date Sentence Date
Mo./Day/Yr. Mo./Day7Yr.
Referred by Judge________________ Current Offense__________________
PAGENO="0084"
80
Appendix 13
Case I.D.#___________________ 1
Form____________________ 2
Completed by __________________________
Referral Date____________________________
Month - - Day Year
Interview Date____________________________
Month Day Year 12
Sentence Date_____________________________
Month - - Day Year
Referred by Judge_______________________
Current Offense ____________________
Name 6
Last First Middle or ~aiden
Address
-- --
No Street City
Phone No. ________________ Driver License No. _______________________ 3
Sex 1. Male 2. Female Race 1. White ~. Black 3.Other
7 294
Date of Birth____________________ Age Weight
8 Month Day Year 15 16
o How far have you gone in school?
1. None
2. 7 grades or less
3. 8-11 grades
4. 12 grades or diploma
5. Completed business or trade school
6. 1-3 yrs. college
7. 4 yrs. college
8. Post-graduate work
9. Not known
(Put 4 in space at right) 298
PAGENO="0085"
81
Appendix B
o How is your general health?
1. better than average or very good, (I)
excellent or
2. average or good
3. less than average, fair, poor, bad
(Put # in space at right) - ( ) 19
(If less than average) :What are the problems? ( ) 20
Person complains of: (check if yes)
a. being tired or fatigued - ( ) 21
b. general weakness - ( ) 22
c. just feeling bad all over - (. ) 23
d. weight loss or inability to eat - ( ) 24
e. inability to concentrate - ( ) 25
f. difficulty sleeping - ( ) 26
g. increased irritability - ( ) 27
h. difficulty doing his job or taking
care of his home - ( ) 28
o Do you have a chronic disease or illness' Y N ( ) 29
O Have you had any of the following? (check if yes)
a. fatty liver - ( ) 32
b. cirrhosis - ( ) 33
c. pain and/or weakness of legs - ( ) 34
d. anemia - ( ) 36
e. convulsions or epilepsy - ( ) 37
f. diabetes ( ) 38
g. ulcers or stomach problems ( ) 39
h. mental or emotional illness - ( ) 41
i. any severe bleeding problems - ( ) 42
j. pancreatitis - ( ) 43
~( ) 30
Other mentioned
PAGENO="0086"
82
Appendix B
(I
or
(R)
o Are you disabled or do you have any physical
defects? Y N C ) 44
(If yes) :What? - ( ) 45
The handicap limits his adjustment or ability to
perform: (check if yes)
a. in his job situation ( ) 46
b. in friendships or in a
social setting ( ) 47
c. in his family situation ( ) 48
The person has made an adequate emotional
adjustment to the handicap. ( ) 49
The person is using the handicap as an excuse
for drinking or as an excuse for family or job
problems. ( ) 50
o Have you had a serious injury or illness in the past? Y N C ) 51
(If yes) :What was its nature?__________________________ C ) 52
Are you completely well from this (these)? `x' N ( ) 53
o What were you doing that called you to the
attention of the police? ( ) 67
Specific behaviors mentioned:
(check if yes)
a. drunk or impaired driving C ) 68
b. car accident C ) 69
c. asleep in or near car ( ) 70
d. fighting or argument C ) 71
e. staggering ( ) 72
f. molesting or bothering people C ) 73
g. noise making ( ) 75
i. other - ( ) 76
PAGENO="0087"
83
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
o Have you ever been arrested for driving under the
influence of liquor or for impaired driving? ~ N C ) 91
(If yes) :How many times? # ( ) 92
o Have you ever been arrested for being drunk and
disorderly or for public intoxication? y N ( ) 93
(If yes) :How many times? # ( ) 94
Was driving related to any of these? Y N C ) 95
(If yes): In how many instances? #_ ( ) 96
o Have you ever been arrested for reckless driving? Y N ( ) 97
(If yes) :How many times? # ( ) 98
Was this ever reduced from the original charge? Y N ( ) 99
(If yes) : What was the original charge?_ ( ) 100
(Was the original charge DUlL or impaired?) Y N ( ) 101
0 Have you ever been arrested for anything else? Y N ( ) 102
(If yes) :How many times and for what?__________________
Kinds of offenses
Crimes involving property # ( ) 104
Crimes of personal assault # ( ) 105
Crimes involving sex # ( ) 106
Other (list) _____________________ ( ) 297
QUESTIONS A, B, C ARE TO BE ASKED IF OFFENDER HAS A PREVIOUS RECORD
0 A. How old were you at the time of your first
arrest? (yrs.) ( ) 107
o B. How long has it been since your last
arrest? (yrs.) ( ) 108
0 C. Are you currently on probation? Y N ( ) 109
(If yes) :Is non-drinking part of the probation? Y N ( ) 110
PAGENO="0088"
84
Appendix B (I)
CR)
O While driving have you ever been stopped by
police but not ticketed, when you knew you had
been drinking too much? Y N ( ) 112
OHas your driver's license ever been suspended
or reveLed? y N ( ) 113
(If yes) :Now many times? ~ ( ) 114
Was drinking related to the suspension(s)
or revocation(s)? Y N ( ) 116
o Do you have a valid license now? Y N ( ) 115
o Do you feel that drinking is causing any problems
in your life? Y N ( ) 117
(If yes)Can you tell me what these problems are?
118
Problems mentioned: (check if yes)
a. marriage ( ) 119
b. job or employment ( ) 120
c. health ( ) 121
d. court ( ) 122
o Do you feel that you always drink like a social
drinker? Y N ( ) 124
(If no) :How do you differ from the social drinker?
(frequency and amount)
Differs from a social drinker in
the following ways? (check if yes)
a. drinks more frequently ( ) 126
b. drinks greater quantity when
he drinks ( ) 127
c. feels worse after drinking ( ) 128
d. has a compulsion to drink ( ) 129
e. drinks at unusual times ( ) 130
f. other________________________ ( ) 131
PAGENO="0089"
85
o Do you ever find that you drink more than you had
intended to drink?
o Do you usually drink every day?
(If no) :How many days a week do you usually drink?
(If every day record 7, if less than once a week
record 1; if weekends only record 2.)
o Do you usually drink four or more drinks at one
sitting?
O What kind of drinks are these? -
(double martini, boilermaker, straight shots, etc.)
O Where do you usually do your drinking? (check if yes)
a. own home
b. friend's home
c. party
d. bar or lounge
a. restaurant
f. other(list) __________________
o With whom do you usually drink? (check if yes)
1. alone
2. spouse
3. casual drinking companions
4. friends
5. other
O Have you gone on a drinking spree or binge in the
last five years?
o Do you ever get the feeling that you `NEED" or
"REALLY WANT' a drink?
(If yes) :When do these feelings occur?________________
Has it ever happened after you have gone
to bed?
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
Y N ( ) 132
Y N ( ) 134
135
Y N ( ) 136
137
138
139
140
141
142
143
250
251
252
C ) 253
( ) 254
Y N C ) 144
Y N ( ) 145
( ) 146
Y N ( ) 147
66-089 0 - 76 - 7
PAGENO="0090"
Do you ever feel thic way before noon?
Client states he needs a drink
when: (check if yes)
a. angry
b. depressed
c. lonely
d. happy
e. tense or nervous
f. with friends
g. things go wrong
h. at parties
i. at certain times of day
j. other(list) _________________
o Have you ever hidden a bottle of liquor?
O Do you drink to feel less self-conscious and more at
ease around people?
o Do you ever feel that it is easier to start
something after you have had a drink?
O Does drinking sometimes give you courage or
self-confidence?
o Do you feel more quarrelsome or angry after
you have had several drinks?
o Have you been told that you become rowdy or noisy
when you have had too much to drink?
o Have you ever destroyed property or gotten into a
physical fight when you were drinking?
O Have you ever thought about cutting down on
drinking?
O Have you ever felt bad or guilty about drinking?
o Have any of your friends or members of your family
suggested that you watch or cut down on drinking?
o Have you ever been treated for drinking?
(If yes) :When? _______
86
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
Y N ( ) 148
C ) 149
150
151
152
( ) 153
154
155
( ) 156
157
158
Y N ( ) 159
Y N ( ) 160
Y N ) 161
Y N C ) 162
Y N C ) 163
Y N ( ) 164
Y N ( ) 165
Y Ni( ) 166
Y N `C ) 168
Y N ( ) 169
I N ( ) 170
( ) 255
PAGENO="0091"
87
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
O Have you ever taken medicine or pills other
than aspirin to help sober up? Y N ( ) 171
O Have you ever found that you can t remember or
wonder what you did the night before when you
were drinking? y N ( ) 172
ODid you ever fall or seriously injure yourself
when you were drinking? Y N ( ) 173
0 After drinking the night before, have you ever
decided not to go to work the next morning? Y N ( ) 174
(If yes): How many times a year does this happen? ( ) 256
0 Have you ever found that your hands shake and
tremble in the morning? Y N ( ) 176
O Have you ever vomited or been very sick to your
stomach, not while drinking, but the morning
after drinking? Y N C ) 178
O Do you ever drink in the morning before breakfast
or before going to work? Y N ( ) 179
* Do you feel that your health would be better
if you decreased or stopped drinking? Y N ( ) 180
ODo you ever take tranquilizers, anti-depressant
or pep-up pills? Y N ( ) 183
0 Have you ever been told that your drinking was
injuring your liver? Y N ( ) 186
0 Have you ever had bad stomach or abdominal pain? Y N ( ) 187
(If yes) : Did this occur after drinking? Y N ( ) 188
PAGENO="0092"
88
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
0 What is your marital status? (Read choices to person)
1. married
2. single
3. widowed
4. separated
5. divorced
(Put # in space at right) ( ) 191
O IF MARRIED
How long have you been married? (yrs.) ( ) 192
Have you ever been married before? Y N ( ) 257
(If yes) : How many times? ( ) 258
Do you and your (present) wife/husband
get along pretty well? Y N ( ) 193
Do you ever have arguments about drinking? Y N ( ) 194
Do you have any children at home? Y N C ) 196
(If yes) : Do you have any serious problems
with them? Y N C ) 197
Are there any (other) family problems? Y N ( ) 198
(If yes) : What?_______________________________________ ( ) 259
PAGENO="0093"
o IF SINGLE
Have you ever been married?
(If yes) :How many times?
Do you: (check if yes)
1. Go out mainly with one person
2. Go out with several people
in a causal way
3. Not go out with anyone
Do you find that you drink more than
your friends?
Has drinking interfered with any marriage
plans?
o IF WIDOWED
How long have you been widowed?
Have you been married more than once?
(If yes) :How many times?
Are there any children at home?
(If yes) :00 you have any serious problems
with them?
Has your drinking increased since you lost
your wife/husband?
Are you alone most of the tine?
* IF SEPARATED OR DIVORCED
How many times were you married?
Were there any children?
(If yes) :Do you have any serious problems
with them?
Did you have family arguments over drinking?
Has your drinking increased since the
separation or divorce?
Are you alone most of the time?
89
Appendix B
(I)
or
CR)
Y N~() 200
# ( ) 260
261
262
263
Y N
Y N
(yrs.)
Y N
264
265
201
266
267
268
Y N
Y N ( ) 269
Y N C ) 202
Y N ( ) 270
#
Y N
) 271
) 206
Y N C ) 272
Y N C ) 203
Y N ( ) 204
Y N ( ) 273
PAGENO="0094"
90
Appendix B
(I)
or
(R)
o Have you ever been fired? Y N ( ) 225
(If yes) :Why? ( ) 283
O Are you presently employed? Y N ( ) 206
(If respondent is female and answers negatively,
ask if she considers herself a housewife or
homemaker. If she is a housewife, ask her the
"If Employed' questions that follow.)
o IF EMPLOYED
What is your present job? (Title plus description) ( ) 207
(Such as carpenter, clerk in grocery store,
housewife, etc.)
How long have you had this job? (yrs.)_ ( ) 208
How good do you think your work is at
your present job? - C ) 209
1. excellent
2. good
3. fair or poor
(Put # in space at right)
o IF UNEMPLOYED
How long have you been unemployed? (yrs.) ( ) 210
Why are you unemployed?__________________________ ( ) 211
Reason for unemployment:
(check if yes)
a. laid of f previous job ( ) 212
b. fired - ( ) 213
c. strike ( ) 214
d. illness ( ) 215
a. other ______________________ ( ) 216
Did drinking contribute to your job loss? Y N ( ) 217
PAGENO="0095"
91
Appendix B (~)
or
(R)
e Have you had any problems with your job(s) in
the last 3 years' Y N ( ) 274
(If yes) :What kinds of problems
are (were) they? (check if yes)
1. occasional friction with
fellow workers or boss ( ) 276
2. frequent friction with
fellow workers or boss ( ) 277
3. occasional trouble with work. . ( ) 278
4. serious difficulty doing
work, or accidents ( ) 279
5. occasional absence ( ) 280
6. frequent absences ( ) 281
7. difficulty finding employment. - ( ) 282
8. other_______________________ ( ) 275
o What is your main source of support?
0. none
1. salary
2. income other than salary
3. family/friend
4. savings, pension
5. disability benefits, social
security
6. unemployment insurance
7. public assistance
8. other____________________
(Put # in space at right) ( ) 284
PAGENO="0096"
92
Appendix B (J)
(R)
o About how much was your total family income in
the past year? (gross)
1. $2000 or less
2. $2000 - 3999
3. $4000 - 5999
4. $6000 - 7999
5. $8000 - 9999
6. $10,000 - 14,999
7. $15,000 - 24,999
8. $25,000+
(Put # in space at right) ( ) 285
How many children and adults are living
on this income? ( ) 286
children # ( ) 287
adults (18+) # ( ) 288
o How many large debts do you have~ # ( ) 289
o Do you have close friends that you can confide in?
(check if yes)
1. has no friends ( ) 291
2. has only casual acquaintances. ( ) 292
3. has close friends (one or more) ( ) 293
o Would you describe yourself as being lonely a good
deal of the time? Y N ( ) 228
o Do you feel that your life is difficult to manage
and you are not sure how to straighten it out~ Y N ( ) 229
0 Do you feel that you are a problem drinker' Y N ( ) 245
PAGENO="0097"
* 93
Appendix B (()
or
(R)
INTERVIEWER'S INITIAL DIAGNOSIS
(THIS SECTION CAN BE FILLED ~N AFTER THE INTERVIEN IS OVER)
O Drinking pattern:
-Has person previously exhibited a pattern
of controlled drinking~ Y N ( ) 231
-How experienced is this person at drinking?
(Select a value from 1, very inexperienced, to
5, very experienced) ( ) 232
o Interviewer's conclusions
-Do you feel that this drinking situation was
unique and unlikely to happen again? Y N ( ) 88
-Did the client give you evidence of a
past behavior pattern of heavy drinking? `1 N ( ) 89
-Do you feel that without any therapeutic
intervention he is likely to repeat this
drinking behavior within the next 5 years? Y N ( ) 90
o Problem diagnosis:
1. person has no problems
related to drinking
2. person has a temporary
drinking problem
3. person has a long standing
drinking problem
(Put # in space at right) ( ) 234
o Interviewer's physical observation of client:
(check if yes)
a. looks older than stated age. . ( ) 235
b. looks ill ( ) 237
c. has a hand tremor ( ) 239
d. has bloodshot or glassy eyes. . ( ) 240
e. has a flushed face ( ) 241
f. has language difficulty. . . . ( ) 242
g. appears to be markedly below /
average in intelligence. . . . ( ) 243
h. nicotine stains or blisters
on fingers
( ) 294.
PAGENO="0098"
94
QUESTIONNAIRE AND INTERVIEW SUMMARY SHEET
CASE I
1. QUESTIONNAIRE#
2.YES
3. SUBJECT AREA
1, 3, 4, 5, 10, 24, 38
Marital, Family Problems
Recent Stress
Financial Difficulties
MENTAL HEALTH
Abnormal Problems
.
Nervousness, Restlessness, Agitation
Sadness or Depression
Self-Denunciation
General Dissatisfaction
Sleeping Problems
Worry, Fear
Boredom
Rssentoemt
.
Inability to Cope
.
Drinking-Related Problems
14
6, 11, 27, 32
9, 18, 22, 35, 36, 40
12 16 29 30 33 45,
53,57,58
17,28,31,39,55
23, 26, 48, 49
28, 34, 52, 54, 55
20,30, 41
19,42,47
52, 58
27,46
12, 14, 25, 29, 34, 36,
4344
18,25,37, 38, 43 44
45, 55, 51,57
QUESTIONNAIRE
SCORE
PAGE PAGE
1 2 3 TOTAL KEY TOTAL
Key-S (Key-1)x2 =
Key-2 0 (Key-2)xL = -
Q~QUESTIONNAIRE SCORE =
INTERVIEW PAGE
YES
SUBJECT AREA
2,3
Poor Physical Health
Disability: Related Problems
Previous Arrests
Had Been Drinking
Poor Driving History
Poor Drinking Controls
Indication of Physical Dependence on Liquor
(Compulsion to drink: trembling hands, morming
vomiting and nausea)
Marital Problems
Family Problems
Poor Work History
3
4, 5
5-H
5,8
9,10
9,10
11,12
PAGE KEY
INTERVIEW 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 TOTAL TOTAL
SCORE (Key-3)x4
0 0 0 I=INTERVIEW SCORE~
KEY-3 QUESTIONTSAIRE SCORE- ~`
FINAL TOTAL SCIRE=Q+I =
PAGENO="0099"
95
Mr. FLORES. Second, I think it provides the judges-wel1, in addition
to the first provision, I think it provides the judges also with informa-
tion as to why this individual may be drinking, the reason or reasons
behind this individual's present abuse-of-drinking behavior, and we
think that is valuable.
I think it gives the judge-Judge Bell stated earlier-I think it
gi'~tes him a place to start from with respect to deciding whether or
not he is going to follow our recommendation for treatment.
Second, I think the evaluation specialist in their psycho-social eval-
uations also furnish the judge with rehabilitation options with respect
to this individual DWI client and in that respect provides the judge
with information that the judge can use in adjudicating this rndividual
DWI client in deciding whether he is going to accept the recom-
mendation.
Third-and this is very important; it is focal to what was just
discussed between Judge Bell and Judge Spector-between now and,
I guess, June 1977, because of the followup program, we will be in-
volved in a very extensive and intensive followup program On those
individuals that have been randomly assigned for the purposes of
evaluation to the different treatment modalities that we assign people
to.
Now, the issue of the control group came up. In my opinion, that is
a misnomer. I would rather refer to it as a minimum exposure group.
The reason for that is: In research terms, a control group, purely
speaking, would be a group that would receive nothing, no exposure
to anything. Now, these extensive followup interviews that we will be
conducting will require this individual to report at least four times
to the ASAP office. Initially, either prior to the individual entering
treatment or right after entering treatment or initially after being
assigned to the control group, he will report for what we call life
activities inventory interviews, the purpose of which is to determine
whether or not the treatment programs that we are assigning these
people to, No. 1, are effective-is the client showing any type of posi-
tive progress or personality changes as a result of this treatment or
as a result of not receiving the treatment. These are the purposes of
the life activities inventory.
Another purpose of it is, since there are different types of treat-
me.nt anproaches we can use on these individuals, which approach is
best suited for which individual. Each individual is different; lie has a
different personality type; he has different characteristics, and so are
the treatment approaches. They are different.
So maybe it is a question of finding out whether or not this particular
individual with this particular personality type requires this particular
form of treatment. This is what we are trying to find out if we can.
We are not the only ASAP site that is trying to determine this.
There are other sites-there are eight other sites, I believe, or seven
other sites in addition to San Antonio that are trying to determine
this.
So we feel that it is valuable. It is going to provide not only ASAP
and the taxpayer, the Federal Government, with information con-
cerning how effective our treatment is, but I think the judges, too,
the judiciary, the probation office, and the treatment people and the
clients, certainly.
PAGENO="0100"
96
We feel that another function, the problem drinker evaluation center
serves-meets-is that it serves as a referral and coordinating agency
between the judges, between the probation office, between the treatment
agencies.
Once we see an individual and if we have the proper authorization,
we can release our psycho-social evaluations to the treatment agencies
so that when this individual reports for treatment, they at least
have a headstart. They at least know something about why this in-
dividual is drinking the way lie is, why he is drinking abusively,
and how often is he drinking. That is important, I think.
I think Mr. Bradshaw, when he testifies later. can kind of support
me on that. I think that is a tremendous help to him.
Fifth, I think the evaluation center serves the driving-while-intoxi-
cated client by giving him the opportiuiity `to discuss his arrest and
drinking behavior in a nonpunitive, nonthreatening, noncritical atmos-
phere. All of our evaluation specialists try and provide an atmosphere
of acceptance, an atmosphere of concerned involvement and honesty in
talking with these people, whether it is talking about their particular
driving-while-intoxicated arrest or arrest or their drinking behavior
or any other life-related problem they may be having at the time. It
may not necessarily be a drinking problem. Maybe lie has other prob-
lems and drinking is just a manifestation of them. We need to find
that out so that we can do something appropriate for that individual.
So, for that reason, we think we serve a pretty vital function.
Also-this is my final point-the evaluation center provides the
ASAP project and Southwest Research with statistical data and infor-
mation the project and Southwest Research use to evaluate the overall
progress of the project, so we provide several vital functions, and we
think we do those pretty well.
This was intended primarily to kind of give you an idea of what we
do and why we do those things, and now it might be a good idea to
kind of give you a. clear picture of `how we get the individual and what
goes on from that point.
Usually the evaluation effort begins with the referral of the driving-
while-intoxicated client from either the county courts or the district
attorney. A referral from the county court is made by the judge
when the individual has applied for probation and the judge is con-
sidering granting probation. Usually lie is referred from the district
attorney's office when the individual is being considered for a reduced
charge, possibly. So this is when we get him.
Once the driving-while-intoxicated client reports to our evaluation
center, then the evaluation effort begins, of course, with the administra-
tion of the Mortimer test.
Now, the Mortimer test consists of essentially two parts~ the self-
administered questionnaire which is comprised of 58 questions. These
58 questions try and get at mainly background information such as
whether the indiviudal is married or not; whether lie and his wife have
ever been separated or considered divorce; whether he has ever been
arrested before; whether or not anyone in his family has ever had
drinking problems or alcohol-related problems; whether he is having
problems at home of any particular nature. It gets into things like does
lie ever feel depressed or restless, bored, these kinds of things.
That takes about 10 to 15 minutes, depending on the individual, to
complete. Because of the clientele that we serve, sometimes it may take
PAGENO="0101"
97
longer. Sometimes we may even have to read the questionnaire to the
individual or translate it into Spanish.
The interview, again depending on the individual, can take any-
where from 45 minutes to an hour, and that is a very structured inter-
view and each evaluation specialist has a set of specific questions he
has to ask during that interview. Basically, it tries to get at such things
as general health, previous arrest and driving history, drinking be-
havior and history, marital, family, and work history, and these kinds
of things so that we have an overall picture of just what kind of an
individual we are dealing with.
The scoring keys show those responses which are expected to be given
by an individual that has a drinking problem.
The scores of the questionnaire and interview are interpreted in the
following manner: He is considered a problem drinker if he scores
between 85 points on the Mortimer test and, I think, approximately
125-would be a problem drinker; above 125 we consider him an alco-
holic. He is pretty bad off. An individual who scores between 60 points
and less than 85 points is considered a borderline problem drinker.
Mr. WRIGHT. Let me intrude a question at this point. We asked a
moment ago for a copy of a test. Is this the test to which you then were
referring, the so-called Mortimer test?
Mr. FLORES. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. And it is a copy of that that we will receive?
Mr. FLORES. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you.
Mr. FLORES. A social drinker, an individual is considered a social
drinker if he scores anywhere below 60 points on the Mortimer test.
Of course, this is backed up, again, by the individual's arrest record
and by the individual's behavior during the interview, during the
testing. We back that up with the rap sheet, also.
There are bits of information that are necessary in order to make
that type of evaluation. You need to talk to the individual; you need
to assess his behavior during the interview-an individual can come
in and take any kind of a written test and if he knows what answers
are expected, what answers are socially acceptable, gosh, he can con
the heck out of you, so this is why we figure that the interview part of
this Mortimer-Filkins test is essential, because it gives us a lot of
information.
The rehabilitation modality that is recommended to the judges or
to the district attorney's office is contingent upon this individual's
classification; that is, whether lie is a social drinker, borderline or a
problem drinker or an alcoholic.
As I mentioned earlier, at the present time we are conducting pretty
extensive followup studies to try and determine if the treatment modal-
ities that we assign people to are effective.
What we do, essentially, when we determine this individual's drinker
status, once we know whether he is a social drinker or a borderline
problem drinker or a problem drinker or an alcoholic, then we explain
to him fully what the ASAP proiect is trying to accomplish, and
that is in the following manner: "The alcohol safety project is con-
ducting an evaluation study to determine whether or not its treatment
program modalities are effective. If you volunteer for this study"-
and you ask them if they want to volunteer, and this is where the
control group comes in-"at most you will be expected to do such and
PAGENO="0102"
98
such. You will be required to attend the alcohol treatment. program"-
or he may be required to attend the alcohol treatment. program in addi-
tion to power motivation training. That will be discussed a little bit
later on in the statement.
Or, "You may be selected for a minimum exposure group," that
being the group that will receive no treatment but will be required
to report to the ASAP office four times within an 18-month period
of time to determine the effectiveness of no treatment.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, you say the decision to recommend one or an-
other of these modalities is based upon the classification into which
this individual falls as a result of his test and interview and so forth.
If a different type of individual is selected for the minimum exposure
group than he who is selected for one of these treatment. programs.
how would we have a comparable situation on which to base an ap-
propriate comparative analysis?
Mr. FLORES. I do not think I heard all of your question, Mr. Chair-
man.
Mr. WRIGHT. All right. I believe I understood you to say that your
decision to recommend one or another of the modalities of treatment
was based on the individual's responses and how you classified him.
Certain classifications you felt would respond best. to one type of treat-
ment; other classifications you felt might respond best to another
type of treatment.
Another classification would be selected for the minimum exposure
group.
Now, this is determined-people fall into these different baskets~
right?
Mr. FLORES. Let me explain how this is accomplished. Let us say
we test an individual-this is an example-and we feel that he is a
problem drinker, let us say.
Mr. WRIGHT. All right.
Mr. FLORES. And we have three-well. we hi'u~-e actually two therapy
options to pick from, but we are going to do it randomly. Here is this
problem drinker; we can either randomly assign him to the alcohol
treatment program or randomly assign him to the alcohol treatment
program and power motivation training, or lie may be assigned to the
minimum exposure group. This is done on a random basis.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, now, then, this random choice is not. then, a spe-
cific choice based upon the analysis of his specific problem.
Mr. FLORES. It is in the sense that we have to determine whether lie
is a problem drinker or a social drinker. In other words. we know a
social drinker power motivation training. although it may be nice for
him to have, is not essential because lie does not have a drinking
problem.
Mr. WRIGHT. All right.
Mr. FLORES. It would be a waste of the theranist's time to conduct
power motivation training on a groun of social drinkers.
Mr. WRIGHT. I understand that. What I do not. understand is what
appears to be a contradiction in the information the committee has
received as to how a determination is made for an individual to be
placed in a category to receive minimum exposure.
As I understood you earlier, these recommendations which you make
ar@ based upon the basket into which these individuals fall.
Mr. FLORES. Right.
PAGENO="0103"
99
Mr. WRIGHT. But then you say a decision is made randomly, and this
seems to me a contradiction in terms. I am trying to understand.
Is it a different kind of an individual for whom minimum exposure
is recommended?
Mr. FLORES. It is the same individual with respect to drinker cate-
gory. In other words, a social drinker can only be randomly assigned to
attend either the AIDE school or its respective minimum exposure
group.
Mr. WRIGHT. All right.
Mr. FLORES. A borderline problem drinker or a problem drinker can
only be randomly assigned to attend either ATP or ATP in conjunc-
tion with power motivation training or its respective minimum expo-
sure group.
At no time is an alcoholic randomly assigned to any treatment-to
a control group, I mean, or minimum exposure group. He is not at all
involved in the random assignment of anything.
At that point the individual evaluation specialist makes his recom-
mendation as to what type of treatment this individual should receive.
This is only for alcoholics, because that became a very controversial
issue and we decided it would be better if we not deal with it.
Mr. WRIGHT. OK. So we have apples, oranges, and bananas.
Mr. FLORE5. Right.
Mr. WRIGHT. Now, if you are an apple, you can either be made into
apple juice or applesauce, and you make this choice randomly, but you
would not take that apple and put him in a banana daiquiri.
Mr. FLoIns. No.
Mr. WRIGHT. OK.
Mr. MYERs. May I follow up one thing, Mr. Chairman?
In order to do something randomly, you have to have a random pat-
tern. Do you have a random pattern knowing that the next alcoholic
in the door under classification A is going to be random, regardless of
who he is, as long as he falls into that classification, he is going to be
in a control group or he is going to be in the ASAP program?
Mr. FLORES. We have no idea in advance. It is just a stack of cards
that each evaluation specialist has on his desk. And the way that is
done: ruhey are all face down; they have all been assigned according to
the table of random numbers, so he has no way of knowing iii
advance-well, I guess he could pull them up if he wanted to. We have
never had that kind of problem.
In other words, the individual comes in and only after the testing
and interview have been completed does he pull the random part, and
this is only after the individual has agreed to participate in the ASAP
program.
Mr. MYERS. How many cards do you have in the deck at the time
you assign random numbers?
Mr. FLORES. Well, I am really not sure.
Mr. MYERS. Well, is it not true-
Mr. FLORES. It is enough cards to last at least 3 months.
Mr. MYERS. Is it not true that in order to have a proper random
distribution of the total population that it has to be representative of
that total population; you just cannot take a week's number or a
m.onth's number and assume that that is going to be random?
PAGENO="0104"
100
I would think you should have a set of random numbers that was
just a continuous-I am not a statistician, but I would assume that
you should approach it from that standpoint.
Do you have a statistical design on the random selection?
Mr. FLORES. Yes; we do, the ones provided by Southwest Research
and the people from the Department of Transportation.
Now, they are the ones who suggested using the table of random
numbers with the stack of cards.
Each evaluation specialist has enough cards to last at least 3 months,
and that has got to be something like well over 300 or 400 cards.
Mr. WRIGHT. This procedure was suggested by Southwest ~esearch
and by the Department of Transportation?
Mr. FLORE5. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Do you agree with it basically?
Mr. FI~RES. I think it is pretty sound.
Mr. WRIGHT. Among the apples-you have decided these people are
apples-are there not some that you think would do better for apple
butter and some that you think would do better for apple juice.
Mr. FLORES. Sure, but in the interest of determining whether or not
the program is going to be effective, we have to maintain some kind
of objectivity. Yes, we get those feelings-"Gosh~ I feel this individual
would probably benefit more from power motivation training than
this individual," but because we have to do it on a random basis, that
is the way it is done.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have to do it on a random basis if you are to get
a true evaluation.
Mr. FLORES. A true evaluation: an accurate evaluation. And it is
very hard, really, to isolate those feelings, but it has to be done in the
interest of the study.
Mr. MYEI~S. Could I ask, Mr. Chairman, why you would have a
3-month backlog of cards with which to deal with?
Mr. FLORES. I guess just for convenience.
Mr. MYERS. In other words, you have people waiting 3 months to
be designated-
Mr. FLORES. Oh, no; no. The cards are just there for our conven-
ience. In other words, they are prepared in advance and randomly
stacked in advance.
Mr. MYERS. Then you pick a card out-
Mr. FLORES. As each individual comes.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you.
Mr. MILFORD. Are you doing any surveys or do you have any studies
in progress here to evaluate as a function of education the programs?
In other words, I noticed in the supplement that was just given to me
that the average education was a sixth grade education. for example,
of your clients?
Mr. FLORES. Right.
Mr. MILFORD. Are you breaking that down further to evaluate
whether high school graduates might respond better as opposed to a
fifth grader or a person with no formal education?
Mr. FLORES. I am not.
Mr. MILFORD. That is not part of this program?
Mr. FLORES. That is not part of the program.
In order to have these people randomly assigned to the different
treatment programs that are available or the respective minimum
PAGENO="0105"
101
exposure groups they have to meet certain criteria, and those are an
education level-I think we have that cut off at seventh grade. The
reason for that is they have to be able to read and write.
Mr. WRIGHT. I believe you have prepared and submitted to the com-
mittee a profile taken from 100 cases selected at random.
I notice that 95 percent are male. At the risk of being facetious, I
would ask if anyone from the women's lib group has suggested that
you are being chauvinistic or discriminatory or is it-this is really
typical, then-that most of the people who are arrested for driving
while intoxicated are males?
Mr. FLORES. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. I was a little alarmed to discover your conclusion that
95 percent in these randomly selected 100 had received at least one
previous arrest for alcohol-related offense and that the average num-
ber of arrests was 4.2, ranging all the way from zero up to 4.7.
Mr. FLORES. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. This 100, you think, then, might be fairly typical of
all the cases you handle or do you think the average person coming
into your evaluation program has been arrested 4.2 times?
Mr. FLORES. I think that is pretty representative, yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Any other questions?
We certainly do thank you and we have sat here and some of us
have tried to read the remainder of your statement, which I assure
you we shall give it very careful attention.
Mr. FLORES. I would just like, if I may, to make a few points that
were brought up earlier in the context of control groups versus treat-
ment and this kind of thing, if that is all right.
Mr. WRIGHT. By all means.
Mr. FLORES. Well, one of the things that kind of struck me was: We
are not deliberately trying to hide the fact that we are placing people
in control groups. The yellow sheet that I think Judge Spector and
Judge Bell showed you has no specific section where we mention the
fact that he is in a control group, but we do mention it in the summary
diagnosis-we do not for Judge Spector because Judge Spector has al-
ready advised me of the fact that she will not comply with that kind of
recommendation.
She and I talked about this at great length, and I see her point. I
can appreciate that there are arguments for both sides. So for Judge
Spector we make no such control group recommendations or minimum
exposure group recommendations. We just do not do it. We under-
stand her position and we leave it at that.
The other point that I would like to make is that if, for example,
someone were to develop what they thought was a treatment modality
or a therapeutic approach for a problem drinker or an alcoholic and
label their treatment, and then you got a group together, a group of
problem drinkers or alcoholics, and exposed them to this so-labeled
treatment modality, in my opinion I would say that that is using
these people just as much for guinea pigs as putting them in a con-
trol group because we really do not know, as Congressman Myers
pointed out earlier, whether or not it is treatment. You are calling
it that; we are assuming it is; but is it really ?
Are we taking an apple and trying to turn it into a banana daiquiri?
We do not know, and I think we need to find out. I think it is essential.
66-089 0 - 76 - 8
PAGENO="0106"
102
And, as' I said, there are arguments for both sides. This is one point
that I would like to bring out.
I believe, Congressman \Vright, you mentioned something about
using a retroactive control group. I think that the people that. are
going through the program now are different, for various reasons
than the people who went through the program 3 years ago, and I
think that we would come out with an unequal comparison if we did
that.
Mr. `WRIGHT. In what ways are they different?
Mr. FLORES. Well, the things that they were exposed to were dif-
ferent. The judges are different; the judicial process is different.
`We have Judge Bell here who considers each individual case on its
own merits. The other judges prior to Judge Bell did not do that. ex-
cept, maybe, `for Judge Garcia. So in that. respect. it. is different.
And I think you would end up with probably a. very biased retro-
active control group, and, so, that would need to be considered before,
you know, applying it.
Those are the only points I would like to make, and if I can answer
any other questions later, I will be glad to. You came a long way.
Mr. MYERS. Mr. Chairman, I had one other question I meant to ask,
and just briefly-
Mr. WRIGHT. All right.
Mr. MYERS. In regard to your testimony~ you indicated that some of
the cases in filling out the test, did not read English and were given it
verbally.
Have you tested whether or not t.he answers-whether when some-
body cannot read they tend to give a different type of answer when it is
read to them and if that is true, if there is any validity to that., I think
that probably it would be well to say that the difficulty that people have
in reading English is because t.hey speak Spanish and read Spanish.
Do you not have any test forms printed in the other native language
here?
Mr. FLORES. Yes, we do. I may have given the. wrong impression.
For those people who are able t.o read Spanish. we. do have copies of
the Mortimer test in Spanish-well, of the questionnaire. anyway-so
that they can sit down and fill out the questionnaire on their own. pro-
vided they are able to read Spanish.
The interview is printed up in Spanish so that the evaluation spe-
cialist can conduct the interview in Spanish. This is one reason why we
have kind of a job requirement that the people we hire be bilingual in
English and Spanish because we do very often come across that type
of problem where we have to conduct the interview in Spanish and it
is difficult to do if you are not bilingual~ so we have that. requirement,
and it causes problems sometimes, but I think it is necessary.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much. Mr. Flores.
Mr. FLORES. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have been extremely helpful to us. Mr. Flores, in-
cidentally, the staff has advised me that in its inquiries with mimerous
people, the judiciary and others, preparatory to these hearings they
repeatedly heard very enthusiast.ic comments about the value of your
activity, so it might please you to know this.
Mr. FLORES. Thank you.
PAGENO="0107"
103
Mr. WRIGHT. Charles W. Nail, Jr., is the chief adult probation of-
ficer for Bexar County.
Mr. Nail, thank you for coming and being with us.
TESTIMONY OF CHARLES W. NAIL, JR., CHIEF ADULT PROBATION
OFFICER, BEXAR COUNTY, TEX.
Mr. NAIL. It is my pleasure, sir. It is a pleasure to appear before
such a distinguished panel.
I am not quite sure what you expect of me, but I presume that you
would like for me to explain my office a little bit.
Mr. WRIGHT. Whatever you feel would be useful to us, Mr. Nail, in
analyzing this project and its effectiveness.
Mr. NAIL. I am appointed by the 11 district judges here with the ad-
vice and consent of the Bexar County Commissioners' Court, Judge
Reeves and the commissioners, and I serve at their pleasure.
My full-time career prior to that was in the FBI. I retired in 1962.
`When I inherited the office, we were in the old courthouse in 1970;
we had a very small office and very few services were rendered or fur-
nished for probationers. They had a large caseload and a small number
of personnel.
Our responsibility by statute is to conduct presentence investiga-
tions when directed by the court, and in felonies it is in every case, and
in misdemeanors we do a brief presentence. `We are charged with the
responsibility of enforcing the conditions of the probation and
charged with the responsibility of attempting to help these people or
rehabilitate them.
The statute also goes into some aspects of furnishing a medical his-
tory, a psychological history, where that can be done.
After I had been there a little while, I was able to apply to the
criminal justice council for $200,000 to enlarge the office with the
blessings of my judges and the commissioners' court. We got that. `We
got new offices across the street in a remodeled building. I doubled
my personnel.
I hired a doctor of psychology, and we brought in a psychometrist.
So that everybody who applies for probation goes through our psy-
chological department on felony cases and all felony-reduced cases and
all misdemeanor cases that we think should go through there.
We set up a job placement department in which we would get jobs
for these people and which has been very successful.
We designed our office so we could bring counselors from the Texas
Rehab Commission into our office who handle people who are handi-
capped emotionally, mentally, or physically. They do a fantastic job.
We set our office up just prior-or we were in negotiation just about
the time that ASAP came into being here in San Antonio.
They spent a considerable amount of time with me in my office. I was
glad to help them, and I am still glad to help them in any way that
I possibly can.
There are a number of alcoholic treatment centers in San Antonio,
M.H. & M.R., the Alcohol Treatment Center; there is CARP; there
is MAUC; the San Antonio State Hospital. We use them all. They all
have different features that we like from time to time.
PAGENO="0108"
104
For instance, CARP is the only agency that will go out to a man
who has beaten up his wife and is breaking the furniture. The rest,
as I understand it-and if I am wrong, correct inc-want the alcoholic
to come to them voluntarily.
Well, you can see in some instances we like to use CARP. Any
agency that can help an alcoholic, any agency that can help a drug
addict-and in this State we have about 300 of those on probation-
any agency that can help any of our people, we appreciate and we go
to. We want to go to them.
We had about 600 DWI cases a year before-am I talking too fast ~
Mr. WRIGHT. Go ahead.
Mr. NAIL. Before A.SAP started, we would average about 600 DWI
cases a year and we knew that they were going to increase our caseload
because when the San Antonio Police Department. which is a fine orga-
nization, concentrates on a certain area like DWI's we are going to
get more cases. There is no question about it. So we jumped to several
thousand a year.
I felt at the time that I was getting my additional personnel that
I was sufficiently able to handle the increase of cases, which I think
that we were.
I do not think there is any question but that ASAP's impact upon
San Antonio has been terriffic. The mere fact of the arrests in itself
indicates that it has had a tremendous impact.. I think the purpose of
it is excellent.
I think they go to high schools and they show photographs and films
and they pass out brochures, and they have a lot of publicity on D\VI
which is excellent.
I do not think that-well, we have never had another agency that
had the money or the time to devote to that, and I think prior to ASAP
DWI's were more or less brushed under the rug, so to speak, and now
we are all conscious of it and it can never go back to what it was be-
fore. We realize there is a tremendous problem. We want these people
off the roads if we possibly can.
I have no quarrel with anybody. My only comment is that I think the
funding by the Department of Transportation pertaining to probation
should have come through my office or at least control or the super-
vision of it should have come through my office. We are set up to do it
and we are prepared to do it, and I would hope if there is any future
funding that we will have an opportunity to apply for that.
I think a profile of the people that come through our office as
DWI's shows that he is about 35 years old, male, has about an eighth
grade education; he is totally unskilled as far as work is concerned;
and he makes about $400-$500 a month. That is not too far off from our
regular poverty profile. He is younger; he makes a little less money;
a.nd he is single. but he still has an eighth grade education and he has
no skills by which he can make a living.
Any of these DIVI's that come through our office go through our
job placement if they need a job. We will find them a job. They will
go to Rehab if they need to go there. And we will help them in any
way we can.
I think we have been working fairly smoothly together. I see no
ieal tension except recently when this random selection or control was
first brought to our attention-and we were not told about it; it came
to our attention through the courts and my people.
PAGENO="0109"
105
Please understand me, I do not know as much about it as some of
my people. They handle it; I do not. I have six officers who handle
misdemeanors.
They had some cases in which a man was an alcoholic; there was no
recommendation for treatment.
Well, the man enters into a contract with the court, a behavorial
contract. We have a printed form that says certain things on it. It is
behavioral. The judge signs it, the probationer signs it, the probation
officer signs it. We bring these people back to the court, they go over
the conditions in English and in Spanish so that they understand it,
and then they report to us once a month or wherever else they have to
go to.
If it is treatment, we add a special condition on it that they go to
M.H. & M.R. that they go to CARP, or they go to whatever it is.
I do not know what else I can tell you about my office. If you have
some questions about it-we stand committed to help anybody and
everybody, but I cannot accept a recommendation of an alcoholic that
he gets no treatment, because we make our own recommendations to
the court at the same time. The court gets two recommendations; it
gets one from ASAP and it gets one from us.
And in theory the ASAP evaluation is supposed to come to my office
and it is attached to our report and our recommendation and then it
goes to the court. We get the file 30 days before the hearing and we
get the complete DA file at that time.
Where they agree, fine; I have no objection. But by good conscience
and by my obligation to my office, I have to have my men recommend
treatment for anyone who needs it. That is about all I can say to you.
Mr. WRIGHT. I thank you. I have observed that Mr. Nail has re-
mained here all day to be available to us, and we are sorry we were
so late in getting to you, notwithstanding the fact that he has an ap-
pointment in Dallas tomorrow, and we do not want to belabor you and
keep you here overly long, but we appreciate your appearance before
us.
Mr. MYERS. I think Mr. Milford has to leave.
Mr. MILFORD. I just have one thing that I am trying to get straight
in my own mind here. As a probation officer, your work is primarily
one which is, I will say, an operational technique. You are at all times
trying with whatever means known to you to rehabilitate the person.
Am I correct?
Mr. NAIL. That is right.
Mr. MILFORD. As I understand ASAP, this is an experimental pro-
gram that is desired to develop totally new concepts, totally new tech-
niques that may not even be known to the operational factions in our
country at this time. Do you understand it the same way?
Mr. NAIL. I really do not understand the evaluation operation. I
think they tried to tell me about it.
Mr. MILFORD. I think this may be a real key thing here. As I under-
stand the ASAP program, they are not out there to take your job
or to replace even your function, but it is as if it were an experimental
lab trying to devise a new drug that does not exist at this time, and
in order to devise that new drug, there i~ a certain amount of experi-
mentation that must take place.
It is, as we. discussed earlier, kind of a difficult thing because you
are going to have to have a control group or a group that is a known
PAGENO="0110"
106
or a norm before you can get over here and find out whether this new
technique or this new drug is going to work. and as such, really, it
should be perhaps a separate function from normal probation activi-
ties, because perhaps they can give you a. better drug that can help do
exactly what you are trying to do. Because I gather from your con-
versation you are a very dedicated individual that wants to protect
every person that is assigned to your jurisdiction.
But I wonder if in your own mind you are making this recognition
of what ASAP really is, is an experimental unit. Perhaps the thing
they are trying to do, if it works, could give you a better tool.
Mr. NAIL. I will accept it if they can. I am for them. If they can
come up with something that will help an alcoholic, which is one of the
hardest things to handle-even over dope or drugs-I am for it. I will
take anything that I can get. I will do everything that I can to help,
provided that it does not cost me my manpower and put more burden
on my men.
Mr. MILFORD. Because I am the last man in the House of Representa-
tives that wants to send somebody from the Federal Government clown
to San Antonio to run San Antonio's business.
Mr. NAIL. I understand that.
Mr. MILFORD. Thank you.
Mr. WRifiIIT. Mr. Myers.
Mr. MYERs. Mr. Nail, if the Federal Government had not. decided to
extend the grant to the ASAP program for San Antonio. what would
your recommendation have been to the county officials in regards to
the program?
Mr. NAIL. I would have asked for one more psychometrist and run
them through my psychological department. They said that they were
going to send them and I had to prepare for it. I had 2~000 or 3,000
people on DWI's.
And I had asked-I was proposing that M.H. & M.R.. conduct the
driver education school or AIDE, that. they call it. I think the San
Antonio Safety Council developed that. that driver's education or
AIDE school, with the funding or the. backing of ASAP. and they
show pictures and films and whatnot, and I think Mr. Langland at one
time offered that to Judge Reeves. and we were prepared to go right on.
Bexar County is taking this a step further and they hired a psy-
chiatrist. We now have a psychiatric, psychological department. We
have Dr. Cannon, the psychiatrist; we have Dr. Schraeder in my office
who is a psychornetrist; and they recently hired a doctor and psycho-
metrist.; and they recently hired a doctor and psychometrist for the
juvenile department, so we have every case tha.t the court.s try-all
they have to do is pick up the phone and they have a psychiatrist or
psychological expert down there to testify.
Mr. MYERS. I gather your staff is probably like, most staffs either in
Government or private in terms that. it is probably busy and staffed
to the degree of the workload that you now have. Is that true?
Mr. NAIL. The workload is outrageous. I have 20 probation officers
and. I have 5,300 people on probation.
Mr. MYERS. I would assume that with that workload you are prob-
ably somewhat limited in your ability to research and develon new
technicues for dealing with probation and with solving the problems
related. to the clients you handle. Is that true?
Mr. NAIL. That is correct. I have personally, called a community re-
search specialist whose job it is to go out and find different places and
PAGENO="0111"
107
different treatment centers for us, and they find something almost
every week-something new has cropped up that we can use, and we
are continually looking for it.
Mr. MYERS. But is it not true that the agencies with which you find
yourself dealing are not designed to specifically attack the problem of
the driver that has a drinking problem, that they are either mental
health and retardation programs, general application of alcoholics, or
some sort of community development, but they really are not designed
from the ground up to determine what it is that must be done or should
be done in regards to the drinking drivers?
If that is true, would you not feel that it is actually a crutch for
your future that the Federal Government has been willing to subsidize
a program to do this specific research which, if it turns out well and if
it gives someone some insights on what should be done, that they would
then be available for you to incorporate in your normal day-to-day
activities without allocating, say, 10 percent of your staff or something,
to research and development? Do you not see that as an asset?
Mr. NAIL. Yes, I agree. Anything that is going to be an asset if it
is successful and if it is-if it can be incorporated into my office in the
proper manner.
Mr. MYERS. Do you see the ASAP program as it is developed will be
transferable to offices such as yours with little or no-once it goes
operational-little or no difficulty?
Mr. NAIL. All I have to do is add some psychometrists to my office
for evaluation purposes. In fact, Dr. Schraeder-we could even make
an evaluation of the evaluation by Dr. Schraeder in our office if neces-
sary~~L~~of course, she does not have time to do that, but all I have to
do is add personnel to my office.
Mr. MYERS. Who in your county would make the decision to con-
tinue such a program?
Mr. NAIL. Bexar County Commissioners' Court.
Mr. MYERS. And what information and statiStics would you expect
them to act favorably or disfa.vorably on a suggestion of such a
program?
Mr. NAIL. I think they would be favorable.
Mr. MYERS. Well, I am asking you what sort of statistics do they
need to act favorably or-say, for instance, the Federal Government
got out, and someone in the county made a suggestion that the pro-
gram be transferred to your department. What are they going to need
in the way of statistics and evidence to convince them that it is a pro-
gram worth funding at this level?
Mr. NAIL. I really do not know what they are going to come `up with
for evaluation. Now, I would assume that they would come imp with a
program or a.n equation that they could take one individual as he comes
in-
Mr. MILFORD. Would the gentleman yield at this point?
Mr. MYERS. Yes, sir.
Mr. MILFORD. I am with you, and perhaps we can assist you. Here
this morning the mayor testified that to pick up the cost of this pro-
gram, which roughly is $2 million, that the city would have to increase
the tax rate by about 8 cents. Well, the County Commissioners would
have to do something similar to that, and do you think that under this
stage right now they would be willing to do it?
PAGENO="0112"
108
Mr. NAIL. Well, as you know, when you are talking about money, it
becomes rather difficult.
Mr. MILFORD. This is our point, and to follow up what the gentleman
from Pennsylvania is trying to find out, we have got to first prove to
somebody that this concept is-that it works.
Mr. NAIL. I want to try to bring to your attention-what I am. trying
to get across to you gentlemen is that the Commissioners' Court has al-
ready contributed some money to this evaluation program by giving it
to the city. I do not know how much it is. And, then, the city is paying
the salaries for this evaluation center, so they have already given in to
the evaluation program.
But they would continue-I think Judge Reeves, if he is in office at
that time-he is very progressive and he has been very helpful to me
and my office-I think, without question, that he would go along and
take it up.
Now, on the police department, you have a city problem which is a
lot of money.
I do not know whether I answered your question. I do not know
whether I can.
Mr. MYERS. Do you see any imminent barriers between you and
ASAP that cannot be resolved over the continuation of this program?
Mr. NAIL. I see no barriers of any kind. There never has been. The
only time that I object to ASAP is if they come in and request me to
do something that is a burden on my people, I ca.mmot do it, and then
I refuse.
Mr. M~s. Have they been doing that?
Mr. NAIL. Well, I think in the past there there were some records
and whatnot that they thought we should keep, and I cannot do it.
Mr. MYERS. Would you expect in the 2-year extension that those
problems will not confront you?
Mr. NAIL. You mean 2 years from now
Mr. MYERS. Yes; during the continuation of this Federal program.
Mr. NAIL. Oh, we have-
Mr. MYERS. You do not anticipate any problems?
Mr. NAIL. We have no particular problem at. this point except when
my people feel that their recommendations do not. meet our require-
ments.
Mr. MYERS. Thank you.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have a very difficult task with each of your proba-
tion officers having maybe 260 probationers, so they are busy people.
Mr. NAIL. Yes, sir. We have streamlined our office to accommodate
that. We are having job counseling, rehab, and so forth, and t.hey send
the people in there to do some of those proj ects.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much, Mr. Nail. We very much ap-
preciate it.
I wonder if Mr. Myron P. Billy, medical social consultant for the
Texas Department of Public Welfare, an instructor at. the AIDE
Schooj, and Mr. Buddy M. Bradshaw. the program director of the
alcohol treatment program, would come forward jointly.
Mr. Billy and Mr. Bradshaw, we appreciate your coming.
PAGENO="0113"
109
TESTIMONY OF MYRON D. BILLY, MEDICAL SOCIAL CONSULTANT,
TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WELFARE, INSTRUCTOR, AIDE
SCHOOL; AND BUDDY M. BRADSHAW, PROGRAM DIRECTOR,
ALCOHOL TREATMENT PROGRAM
Mr. BRADSHAW. I am Buddy M. Bradshaw, program director for the
alcohol treatment program.
Mr. WRIGHT. Gentlemen, if you would just proceed, either of you, at
your convenience.
Mr. BILLY. Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, I am Myron
Billy.
From June 1, 1973, through August 31, 1974, I was executive direc-
tor of the Greater San Antonio `Safety `Council. From September 1
1974, to April 30, 1975, I was the AIDE program coordinator with
the council.
While serving in both capacities, I `also presented classroom in-
struction.
Prior to joining the Greater San Antonio Safety Council, I was in
Federal service for approximately 22 years, a goodly portion of which
was transportation oriented.
My topic is rehabilitation, specifically the AIDE program.
Under my predecessor, 44 behavioral modification-the former des-
ignation of AIDE-classes were conducted. During my affihia~ion with
the council, there were 117 classes completed. To date, I have person-
ally instructed 47 of these classes.
The San Antonio alcohol safety action program, through a sub-
contract with the Greater San Antonio Safety Council, operated a
four-session, 10-hour AIDE school. The classes were 21/2 hours long
and were held once per week for 4 consecutive weeks on the same week-
day evening or `Saturday morning.
Presently, the classes are 2 hours, four sessions, a total of 8
hours. The size of each class ranges from 15 to 50. The typical class
has 25 to 30 new members and a'bout 10 reenrollees who have failed to
graduate from their original class.
The AIDE school enrollees, `all of whom were arrested for D'WI,
came from the two sources already mentioned, Alcohol Learn and the
county courts at law.
The AIDE program is one of the most heavily emphasized rehab
countermeasures in the San Antonio safety action project. The objec-
tive of this measure is to minimize the occurrence of alcohol-related
driving events through group education of court referred and Alcohol
Learn drinking drivers.
The classes were originally conducted at the San Antonio Police
Department classrooms. They were later moved to the civil defense
headquarters classroom and subsequently to Our Lady of the Lake
CollegeS where they are presently located.
The method of instruction relies on individual response in a group
setting. Therefore, the curriculum is structured for interaction be-
tween the student and the instructor. The objective of this curriculum
is to educate social drinkers arrested for DWT toward an attitudinal
PAGENO="0114"
110
change, modification of their behavior, and personal preventive plans
in order to minimize their chances of driving uhile intoxicated.
In respect that the school is geared toward attitudinal change in
the individual, minimal instructor criteria was established as a mas-
ter's degree in a behavioral science discipline; that is, a phychological
guidance or counseling or social work degree.
The class orientation is multifaceted. In portion, it is didactic
when alcohol education material is presented. The interaction phase
occurs in group discussion about social and emotional situations often
resulting from presented tape and film material or from the students
themselves.
The AIDE school was funded by ASA.P, and a $12 tuition was
charged to help defray costs. This cost has been reduced to an $8
tuition presently. However, the fee is not pressed if the client is
indigent.
I would like to discuss in condensed form the. school curriculum,
if I may.
In session 1, we approach the drinking driver. We give him some
didactic type of information such as the seriousness of drinking driv-
er problems, statistics; we go into such things as the number of alcohol-
related accidents and fatalities.
We then assign a narrative stating what the student did 12 hours
before arrest. He will present this at the next class. This is sort of an
introspection type of operat.ion.
When we come to session 2, we talk about how alcohol affects the
body, through a film called "Alcohol and the Human Body." which
traces the flow of alcohol through the body and indicates the effect
of alcohol. We collect the papers from the previous class, we discuss
them, and then we give them another assignment, and we ask them
to come up with a paper discussing what alternate action they could
have taken to prevent being arrested or to avoid the DIVI.
In session 3, it is more or less a self-analysis for symptoms of
the problem drinker. In this particular area, we use the test that has
been established by the Council on Alcoholism. They self-test them-
selves, and then we talk and evaluate them on their results.
Mr. WRIGHT. Is this the so-called Mortimer-Filkins test. to which
reference was made?
Mr. BILLY. This is a. different one.
Mr. `WRIGHT. A different test?
Mr. BILLY. Yes, sir. It is a simple multiouest.ion test that can be
answered "Yes" or "No". This is the only thing that is required. If
they answer a certain number of yeses-to wit, three-then they
must ask themselves: "Am I really looking at myself as I should
because Tam a potential alcoholic?"
Mr. WRIGHT. I wonder if it would be possible for us to have a copy
of those questions for the record.
[The following was received for the record:]
NATIONAL COUNCIL ON ALCOHOLISM INVENTORY QUESTIONS
1. Do you sometimes drink excessively when you are disappointed, argued with,
or aggravated by someone?
2. Do you drink more than usual when you are troubled or under pressure?
3. Are you able to drink more now without feeling it than when you first started
to drink?
PAGENO="0115"
111
4. Do you suffer memory losses of events during the evening, and yet not pass
out?
5. Do you try to squeeze in a couple of extra drinks during the evening, without
other people knowing it?
6. On some occasions, do you feel ill at ease if alcohol is not available?
7. Are you rushing more to get that first drink than you did, say last month?
8. Do you occasionally have feelings of guilt about your drinking?
9. When your friends and family discuss your drinking, do you quietly resent it?
10. Are your "blackouts" more frequent recently?
11. Do you want to continue drinking when your friends say "enough"?
12. Do you have a reason when you get drunk?
13. Are you embarrassed by the things you say and do when drunk?
14. Have you switched drinks or changed your pattern to control your drinking?
15. Do you promise myself to control your drinking and then break the promise?
16. Have you changed jobs or moved to a new place to control your drinking?
17. Do you avoid friends and family when drinking?
18. Are financial and work problems increasing?
19. Do you feel people are treating you unfairly?
20. When drinking, do you eat irregularly and very little?
21. Do you take another drink in the morning to quiet your "shakes ?"
22. Has your drinking capacity decreased lately?
23. Do you occasionally stay drunk for several days?
24. Are you sometimes depressed and feel that life isn't worth living?
25. Do you occasionally have hallucinations after a period of drinking?
26. Do you have vague fears after drinking heavily?
Mr. BILLY. At this time also, we hand out some fliers telling the
people that if they do have problems what agencies they can contact
and what sort of services are available for them.
In session 4, we get into a personal action type of session. Formerly
we had a test at this point, but we found out that we did not require
this any more to see the amount of information that they did receive
in the three sessions prior to this fourth.
WTe talk about the personal effects to DWI's such as costs, loss of job,
loss of homes, things of this nature, and then we can summarize our
student responses.
The focus, in summary, of all the curriculum is to, one, find out
what alcohol does to most people; two, what does alcohol do to me as
an individual; three, what does alcohol do to you as a driver-really
the focal point of the entire program-and what steps can you take to
prevent driving while impaired or legally intoxicated.
Sir, are there any questions?
Mr. WRIGHT. That is very interesting. Mr. Bradshaw, now, let me
see if I have the differentiation clearly marked in my mind. Mr. Billy,
the program that you have been describing is that which has been
referred to earlier as the AIDE program?
Mr. BILLY. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. And this is a series of four 2-hour sessions for those
who have been classified not as problem drinkers but more so social
drinkers?
Mr. BILLY. Right.
Mr. WRIGHT. On the other hand, Mr. Bradshaw, you have the even
more difficult task of trying to cope with those who have been classified
as really problem drinkers; is that correct?
We have a very good, comprehensive statement from you here. I
wonder, in the interest of time, if we could enter it in the record-
Mr. BRADSHAW. That is what I would like to do. If you would accept
my statement for the record, I would appreciate it.
Mr. WRIGHT. Without objection, it is so ordered.
PAGENO="0116"
112
[The statement referred to follows:]
STATEMENT OF BUDDY M. BRADSHAW, DIREcTOR, BEXAR COUNTY MENTAL HEALTH
MENTAL RETARDATION CENTER'S ALCOHOL TREATMENT PROGRAM
The following testimony concerning the Alcohol Safety Action Project is
presented by Mr. Buddy M. Bradshaw. Mr. Bradshaw is a retired Lt. Col. from
the TJSAF and is considered an authority on alcohol treatment and prevention.
He established the Drug, Alcohol Rehabilitation system for the Air Force'sAir
Training Command and was one of the writers of the policy and implementing
manual on Drug and Alcohol Education and Rehabilitation for the Department
of the Air Force. He possesses a Masters Degree in Guidance Counseling from
Our Lady of the Lake College with a specialization in Alcohol and Substance
Abuse. He has worked for the Bexar County MHMR Alcohol Treatment Program
for the past two years.
Mr. Bradshaw is currently the Director of the Bexar County Mental Health
Mental Retardation Center's Alcohol Treatment Program. This comprehensive
Alcohol Treatment Program is the most extensive in the San Antonio metroplex
and has been accredited by the Joint Commission on Accreditation of Hospitals.
The Program not only provides 24 hour Emergency Medical Services but a
multifaceted after care service which includes both Residential Treatment and
Outpatient counseling. The Program's Consultation and Education component
has been a pioneer in alcohol prevention education in community services, schools,
hospitals, business and industrial settings and law enforcement. Realizing the
unique position of business and industry in combating alcohol abuse the Program's
Occupational Alcoholism Department has made strong efforts to establish Em-
ployee Assistance Programs to assist employees with family living problems that
impair their efficiency on the job. Mr. Bradshaw with a masters degree in
guidance and counseling is both a therapist and an administrator who under-
stands the problems and motivation of an alcoholic because he is a recovered
alcoholic.
The Alcohol Safety Action Program has made it possible to reach a segment
of the alcohol abusing population that has been almost impossible to reach-
the functional alcoholic. There are 10 million adult and one million teenage
alcoholics in this nation that cost the national economy over 825 billion annually.
07% of this number are, what we call, functional alcoholics. By our definition a
functional person is one who has a job, has a family, drives an automobile and
is in the early stages of alcoholism or alcohol abuse. The other 3% are chronic
inebriates who do not have a job, or a family and depend totally on the hand-
outs of society for their existence. The major thrust of alcohol treatment
facilities, up until the last few years, has been with the visible chronic inebriate
and the recidivism rate has been excessive. The causes of this high recidivism
rate lie in the very basic philosophies of the requirements for successful recovery
of the alcOhol abuser-constructive intervention or constructive coercion. To
stop drinking the alcoholic must be faced with the loss of something he doesn't
want to lose, i.e., his life, his family, his job, his place in society or his health.
Neither moralizing nor scorn have historically been effective in getting individ-
imals to accept responsibility for their arrant drinking behavior nor to recognize
their need for treatment. Urgent pleas from family. loved ones and friends to
stop "doing whatever they are doing" are not normally responded to in a
positive way by the person with a runaway alcohol abuse problem. Alcohol
abuse as in most illnesses is treated most effectively in its early stages. But
as in most illnesses early detection of the problem is the most difficult part of
the treatment. The functional alcoholic possesses things the chronic inebriate
does not possess. The chronic street inebriate has nothing to lose and therefore
intervention with him/her is difficult. Because of the lack of success with this
type, the focus is being turned to the functional alcoholic, while not neglecting
the "street person." However, the major problem has been in reaching the
more functional individuals to get their attention to the degree that they will
accept treatment. These same situations occur with women. Of the abusing
population approximately 25% are ladies.
A lot has been done with prevention education but since monies appropriated
for alcohol services has been inadequate to meet the total needs. most is being
spent in treatment because the need is so great. Therefore, to reach the func-
tional alcoholic we have had to depend on the referral by family, or business
and the individuals' own recognition that he has a problem and his commitment
to help himself.
PAGENO="0117"
113
The Alcohol Safety Action Project has given us that constructive coercion
instrument so necessary to reach the functional alcoholic. Most functional
alcoholics drive automobiles at one time or another. On apprehension the drink-
ing ctriver goes to court to state his case and apply for probation. It is at this
time that the judge calls for the assisthnce of the Alcohol Safety Action Project.
Qualified staff conduct a pre-sentence investigation and recommencE appropriate
treatment for the drinking driver to the probation office and the court. The
offender is then sent to the various treatment facilities in the communities as
a condition of their probation. Involuntary referrals such as this comprise a
significant proportion of our aiitpatient clients. Many of these people are func-
tional and are in on various stages of alcohol abuse. The threat of stringent
punishment has provided the impetus necessary for the alcohol abuser to assume
a more responsible role in the community and to accept responsibility for his/her
own recovery. This will in turn reduce the drain on the business and national1
economy. Referral through the court system, ASAP and Probation to our out-
patient department constitute some 60% of those entering our treatment facility
and although this represents only 5% of the total alcoholic population it is an
extremely vital first step in reaching those who stand the best chance of recovery.
Alcoholism is the fourth worst major health problem in the nation. Considering
that the major medical authorities agree that it is a treatable illness, it is diffi-
cult to rationalize the reasons that more money is not spent on the reduction
of the numbers of people affected by it. Considering the money spent in finding
cures for heart disease and cancer, the money spent on alcohol treatment is
significantly small. Yet over 35 million people are affected, directly and indirectly
by alcoholism, at a total cost of $40 billion and immeasurable human suffering.
More money needs to be appropriated to expand the ASAP Program and equally
as important more money must be made available for alcohol treatment and
prevention. To more fully understand the dilemma facing those who deal with
this problem you must accept that to be effective in the reduction of alcohol
abuse there must be equal attention paid to treatment and prevention. The
austere funding level that we are required to operate under has created a
paradox-because of money problems, it is an either or situation-either treat-
ment or prevention. The result of that paradox is a natural response since the
need for treatment is more vivid-monies for prevention have been necessarily
limited. This has translated to doing less in the much needed prevention area
or stopping the forest raging in treatment needs.
The Alcohol Safety Action Project has turned a new focus on the problem
of alcohol abuse. Historically the courts and law enforcement agencies have
viewed the problem of alcohol abuse as errant behavior with the offender
simply being punished with fines and/or incarceration. This punitive approach
has not been the answer. The results have not been effective enough. The number
of deaths and disabling injuries due to alcohol related accidents have increased;
suicides, and felony arrests because of alcohol abuse have risen and the drain
of the national economy is staggering. Over 50% of the nation's traffic deaths
are caused by the abusive use of alcohol, about 50% of felony arrests in this
country are alcohol related and over 1/3 of all suicides are related t~ alcohol
in some manner. It is suggested that a pragmatic view toward the problem of
alcohol abuse would be more appropriate and that we accept the fact that the
strictly punitive approach to alcohol abuse has not been the answer. However,
when associated with treatment, judicial action provides the impetus, if you
will, the constructive coercion, required to get the alcohol abuser and their
family involved in the recovery process. The courts must be strong in directing
proper treatment-it must apply to the affluent who can pay the fine as well
as the less fortunate who cannot pay fines. The system should be so effective
that all who are apprehended must enter the judicial process.
Not only the continuation but the strengthening of the ASAP Program is
needed since it is primarily an investment in humanity as well as an invest-
ment that will pay dividends in dollars and cents by reducing the heavy toll of
innocent lives lost and property damage.
Mr. BRADSHAW. There are some highlights from the statement
that I would like to touch upon.
Mr. WRIGHT. We would like you to do that, and in particular, if
you would, differentiate between the type of treatment that has just
been described for the social drinker as to what may be required for
the problem drinker.
PAGENO="0118"
114
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes, sir. If I can start and follow the highlights of
my statement, I would appreciate it.
As I introduced myself, I am the director of the alcohol treatment
program of Bexar County Mental Health and Mental Retardation.
We are a Federal-, State-, and county- and city-funded program.
We have viewed the alcohol safety action program from a~ very
favorable point of view because it has made it possible for us to reach
a segment of alcohol-abusing population that has been almost im-
possible to reach, the functioning alcoholic. There are 10 million
adult and 1 million teenage alcoholics in the Nation, that cost the
national economy over $25 billion annually. Ninety-seven perêent of
this number are what we call functioning alcoholics.
By our definition, a functional person is one who has a job, has
a family, drives an `automobile, and is in the early stages of alcoholism
or alcohol abuse. The other 3 percent are chronic inebriates who do
not have a job or `a family, and depend totally on the handouts of
society for their existence.
The major thrust of the alcohol treatment facilities for the last
few years have been with the visible chronic inebriate and the recidiv-
ism rate has been excessive. The causes of this high recidivism rate
lie in the basic philosophies of the requirements for successful recovery,
constructive intervention of some kind, constructive coercion.
To stop drinking, the alcoholic must be faced with the loss of
something he does not want to lose; his life, his family, his job, his
place in society or, in many cases, his life as it pertains to his health.
Neither moralization nor scorn have historically been effective in
in getting individuals to accept the responsibility for their errant
drinking behavior nor to recognize their need for treatment. And I
think that that is the most important thing there that I would like
to bring out, is the fact that the Alcohol Safety Action project has
provided the two-by-four to apply to the person and get his attention
to a degree that he does need help, that lie must come for help-under
the condition of his probation he must come for help.
Therefore, we view it, from the treatment point of view, as being
most helpful to us in the treatment process. A person must be receptive
to treatment, he must be motivated to help himself.
Frankly, I think that motivation is one of the more key, essential
points in the process of recovery.
Alcohol abuse, as in most illnesses, is treated most. effectively in its
early stages, but, as in most illnesses, early detection of the problem
is the most difficult part of the treatment.
The functional alcoholic possesses things the chronic inebriates do
not. The chronic street inebriate has nothing to lose and, therefore,
intervention with him or her is difficult. Because of the lack of success
with this type, the focus is being turned to the functional alcoholic,
but not to the exclusion of the "street person."
I think it is kind of important-we have not discussed one area
that I feel has received some benign neglect. and that is the alcoholic
ladies or the alcohol abusing ladies. I have not heard any discus-
sion and I have been here since the beginning of the testimony that
would speak to the problems that some. of our ladies are experiencing.
Mr. WRIGHT. Ninety-five percent, according to the little random
sample that Mr. Flores gave us-95 percent of those arrested on DWI
PAGENO="0119"
115
charges are male. Now, what happens with the ladies? They are just
not out driving cars, is that it?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Either that or they are sitting next to the man when
he is driving and she is just as intoxicated as he is and, therefore,
from a treatment point of view, we have not received the input from
the alcohol safety program that we would like which would bespeak
the true indication that about 25 percent of the alcohol-abusing popu-
lation are female.
Mr. WRIGHT. Twenty-five percent, approximately?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes, sir, about 25 percent. I think another area that
I think has not been spoken to is the fact that practically-and this is
a kind of unusual statement for a treatment person-but the heavy
emphasis has been toward the spending of money for treatment, when
in fact I would suggest that programs such as ASAP, such as the
educational programs that they have in the school systems, are proba-
bly where we have missed out on a lot of good opportunity, in that
prevention is by far more important that the treatment. And that is,
as I said, a very difficult thing for a treatment person to say, but we
have nationally, I think, neglected the needs for preventive type-
Mr. WRIGHT. But what kind of preventive education would be use-
ful? I think typically the person who is becoming a problem drinker
does not want to admit it to himself.
Mr. BRADSHAW. I think in the context that I am speaking of it, sir,
it is much more elementary than the drinking driver, and I hate to
digress from your real effort.
Mr. WRIGHT. That is all right.
If a person is not a drinker, he is not going to be a drinking driver.
Mr. BRADSHAW. I think that the major effort in prevention as far as
education is concerned should be leveled at the very early years, those
years at second, third, and fourth grade where people are taught how
to deal with their feelings about themselves, because if we are never
taught anywhere other than simple things like how to brush our teeth
and how to hang up our undies at night-this is considered the only
way that children are taught about the problems that they are going
to face in the years to come, but as they become adults they are not able
to respond to some of the stresses that they are feeling in everyday life.
Mr. WRIGHT. And those stresses, I suppose, are becoming more and
more intense.
Mr. BRADSHAW. Absolutely.
Mr. WRIGHT. Now, you are arguing for something that undoubtedly
would be helpful at an early age, but it seems to me awfully difficult,
too, is it not, to design the kind of curriculum or the kinds of warnings
that would alert an individual to these dangers lurking down the road?
Mr. BRADSHAW. It is difficult :but it is one, I think, that as a nation
we must address if we are ever going to get at the tremendously diffi-
cult problems we are experiencing not only in alcoholism but in all the
other mental health areas. It is something that-it is not an automobile
that is coming down the highway; it is a person that is coming down
the highway.
Mr. WRIGHT. That is right.
Mr. BRADSHAW. I think the thing that I have not heard enough of
today is that the focus needs to be on the individual and his or her
needs, and the focus toward treatment and toward rehabilitation is to
PAGENO="0120"
116
meet their specific needs. The focus needs to be on making them respon-
sible for their behavior rather than other needs.
Mr. WRIGHT. I have heard a lot of commentary and read numerous
treatises which take one of two viewpoints as to the cause of a. persons'
becoming an alcoholic, a compulsive drinker.
There is one school of thought which holds that it primarily derives
from a deep psychological problem resulting from the person's envi-
ronment or the stresses to which a person is subjected.
There is another school of thought to the effect that some people,
by their body chemistry, are predisposed toward a. susceptibility to
alcoholism.
Do you have any fixed view as to whether either or both may be
correct?
Mr. BRADSHAW. I will have to answer yes to both of them. I think
in the context that probably in the main people abuse alcohol because
of the stresses they are feeling both internally and externally, and yes
to your second part which would say that there are certain groups of
people who, because of body chemistry, have an affinity toward getting
themselves into stressful situations, therefore, leading them to use
alcohol. For example, I am an American Indian and we have the most
outlandish percentage of people who die of alcohol, and die of suicide
of any group of people in the Nation. Is it because of our cultural
background? Is it because of our biological makeup? Is tha.t the rea-
son? I do not think that anyone really knows.
I do believe that there has to be something a little different in certain
types of people that makes them have a propensity to that alcohol.
Mr. WRIGHT. Or a chemical imbalance or lack of tolerance for pro-
longed dosage of alcohol.
I think each of us has known in his personal span of acquaintances-
people who seem to function quite well for a long period of time, who
might even have received compliments from their contemporaries on
how well they held their liquor, until at. some point, in their lives, p~i~-
haps in middle age, they would without their having realized it slipped
over to the point that they were compulsive drinkers, lacking the
capacity not to drink once they had one and for whom total abstinence
was the only answer. To some, this occurs at a relatively younger age,
and to others at a relatively later point in life.
Mr. MYERS. Would the gentleman yield?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes; of course, I will.
Mr. MYERS. I would like to inject, that I think if you make those
assumptions, then you do not, I think, recognize the insidious pattern
in which it creeps into the lives of many people.
It is my opinion that you should not just discard the assumption
that possibly alcohol is neither, for a large number of functional al-
coholics, a result of chemistry imbalance or a result of mental stress,
but could quite possibly be the result of a pattern of just unconscious
growth of a life pattern and lifestyle, that the consumption of al-
cohol was not to satisfy a need, but something which was there and
available and grew into the pattern of life.
Mr. BRADSHAW. I could not agree with you more.
Mr. MYERS. And I think if we fail to recognize that. we just. fail
to recognize the insidiousness of the probTem, how difficult it. is to
identif the problem at an early stage.
PAGENO="0121"
117
Mr. WRIGHT. I think all of us will agree with that. I do not see any
inconsistency with that in what we had been saying prior to that.
Mr. Mi~s. I do agree that statistics will say about 15 percent of the
people who become alcoholics are alcoholics from the first drink.
Mr. WRIGHT. Can that really be, Mr. Bradshaw, from your stand-
point?
Mr. BRADSHAW. I have heard it said by many people, that its true.
I find it difficult to prove this. How could you say 15 years before that
you knew at that time when you took that drink that you were going
to become an alcoholic, or would a research person know that.
Mr. WRIGHT. You would not know it.
Mr. MYERS. You misunderstand the point I made. The statement
has been proposed, and I do not disagree with it too much, that 15
percent of the people who become alcoholics are alcoholics from the
first drink, when you use the assumption that an alcoholic is a person
who cannot control his consumption of alcohol. And from that stand-
point, I think that is what the Council on Alcoholism's theory is.
Mr. BRADSHAW. I think the thing that I want to leave you with is
the fact that these are people and people have different needs and
different reasons for finding themselves in the position that they
are in and, therefore, in the treatment of people, if you choose a specific
modality, choose a specific kind of a counselor, you choose a specific
kind of anything and say: "This is the way we are going to do it,"
then we have missed an awful lot of the population of people and,
therefore, the old cliche from the "Laugh-In" program, "different
strokes for different folks," is very true. Different people get into
their problems for different reasons and there are different kinds of
methods of treatment to get them out of their problems.
Mr. WRIGHT. Now, the treatment programs that you administer
must be considerably more intense than those that Mr. Billy has been
discussing, for example. You could not expect to arrest a problem
this deeply ingrained in four 2-hour sessions. Describe to us briefly
how they differ, how a sometimes successful program will differ.
Mr. BRADSHAW. It is not "sometimes successful," sir. I would sug-
gest-let me answer your question with a question: What is success?
That is a question that haunts us in treatment. What would you view
as being a successful treatment of a person if that person-and I do
not mean to be facetious-is having problems to the degree that he is
having family fights once a week and you, through your treatment,
do something to make it once a year? Well, that is a form of success.
I think that in treating people you must look at their needs. Some
of those, persons can be treated in 2-hour-a-week therapy sessions
either with the psychiatrist, a psychologist, a recovered alcoholic
who has been well-trained. It can be done, in say, 2 hours per week
for 6 weeks-depending on his needs.
There are others who may take years to do anything with.
So, to categorically say that one kind of treatment should be corn-
pleted in a cejitain period of time is very difficult, because-our case-
load, for example, runs anywhere from 500 to 600 persons at any given
time, and of that group there are young people down to the age of 11,
12, 13 years of age, and there are elderly people who never have drank
before in their lives until they become lonely, they became bored, they
became ostracized by their own society.
66-089 0 - 76 - 9
PAGENO="0122"
118
So, therefore, what I am saying is that the treatment must be respon-
sive to their needs and, therefore, the length of that treatment has to
be dependent upon what their needs are.
Mr. WRIGHT. And your position, do we understand, then, is that
you try to make a matching of the individual with the type of treat-
ment to which you feel that that individual might be most likely to
respond?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Absolutely.
And I would also like to leave you with this further statement-and
I repeat myself-that the alcohol safety action proj ect and the court
systems provide us with a client who is generally motivated to accept
treatment bceause lie has been placed there with a certain amount of
constructive coercion. He must accept the treatment and it is up to us
to get the right kind of treatment to fit his needs.
Mr~ WRIGHT. To return to an earlier statement, you believ,e that the
strongest motivation in the case of these problem drinkers is to be con-
fronted with the loss or the prospect of the loss of something he does
not want to lose, because absent that he is not going to want to quit
drinking?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Absolutely.
Mr. WRIGHT. Thank you very much, gentlemen. Mr. Myers, do you
have a question?
Mr. MYERS. Yes. First of all, very quickly, I would like to ask Mr.
Bradshaw is he related to Terry Bradshaw?
Mr. BItADSHAW. No; he is about a foot taller and about 200 pounds
heavier.
Mr. MYERS. Did you read the article in the Reader's Digest related
to alcohol and its effect on the brain, the liver, and the heart?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes, I did. It was excellent.
Mr. MYERS. Do you submit information such as that to clients who
come to you?
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes. As a matter of fact, many of the rationaliza-
tions that the clients use is that, you know; "It does not hurt me phys-
ically; I can drink for the next 20 years, and the probability of me hav-
ing cirrhosis is rather limited."
I think that the article in Reader's Digest suggests that if he drank
eight drinks per day for a period of 2 years-i year, I believe it says-
then in all probability you will suffer some form of physical damage
to either the heart muscle, to other organs of the body other than the
liver, which has typically been the criterion for being a chronic
inebriate-
Mr. WRIGHT. Eight drinks a da.y for 1 year--
Mr. BRADSHAW. I think that is right.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, now, would the same thing apply to one drink
per day for 8 years? [Laughter.]
Mr. BRADSHAW. No-
Mr. WRIGHT. It would not?
Mr. BRADSHAW. It would not. I think the body would be able to
repair itself.
Mr. MYERS. I was amazed_just as a little extension to that-I hap-
pened to have attended a dinner here the other night and at the. table
a gentleman happened to describe the drinks that he had for that dayS
and I was just tremendously amazed at the correlation between what
PAGENO="0123"
119
he had given as an example of what he had done-he was just casually
talking in somewhat of a boastful fashion about what he had been
drinking, and I just generally think the American people are not
aware of the effects of alcohol from the physical standpoint of the
body and I would hope that when persons are directed to your agencies
that you certainly are making an effort to communicate this.
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes, sir, but I would like to interject that for some
time now we have all known that cigarette smoking is very hazardous
and it has not in any way, shape, or form, reduced the number of
people who smoke. I think that more than just making them aware is
necessary.
Mr. MYERS. Sometimes you have to wonder why people ask the Fed-
eral Government for national legislation in regard to health insurance,
when in fact I would think that considerable billions of dollars of
Americans' money which goes to satisfying the health bill could be
eliminated or largely avoided, as an example, through alcohol and
these other programs.
Mr. Billy, I would like to ask: In your classes have you attempted
to incorporate with the client his family members during the instruc-
tions?
Mr. BILLY. Yes. Oftentimes some of the people are forced to come
with the student or the enrollee because his license has been taken
away, so consequently they sometimes become a forced type of
participant.
We give them an option. We do not force them into the class. We
say: "If you want to accompany either your brother, sister, father or
loved one, or husband or wife, you may if you so wish."
You see, the thing about this is that over a period of time now we
have had exceedingly good fortune in that when one member of this
type comes into a class, you can pretty well follow that within the
next few classes we will see extra people in there that belong to the
family. I have seen parents bring in children that are in that par-
ticular teenage group where they are just about in the problem age
of drinking, and they obviously point to them-I can see them tap-
ping them on the shoulder and saying: "Do you hear? Do you hear?"
And this goes over.
Now, you also see many times-many times when we bring out
some of the incidences of the male coming home in the condition that
he is and the money that he spends on payday et cetera, and then you
can see the wife saying: "Aha! What did I tell you?"
And these are the things that work because it becomes an inter-
action between the family members.
Now, remember, we are talking about people on a social plane that
have not really been identified in total as alcoholic-total alcoholics.
With this in mind, if we can reach more of the people, and we welcome
them in, and have people bringing their friends in-this has worked
out real well. When you get one individual in that will bring in four
or five of their friends-and you are talking about the younger set;
you are talking about people in the 18-, 19-, 20-year-old set-bringing
these people in.
Mr. MYERS. Does the program invite members of the general public
who have not been an arrest case just as an open invitation to
the general public, those who are concerned about the problem of
alcohol and drinking and driving?
PAGENO="0124"
120
Mr. BILLY. At this time, no, for the specific classes because there
has got to be a certain degree of confidentiality within this particular
class.
We preface our first opening remarks; we tell them that all that is
said within that particular class structure, within those walls, is `be-
tween the instructor and the students, but we will `allow family or a
personal friend to come in because it is an interchange, but I think that
if we `bring in outsiders and expose them to this particular group, we
will find prtha~bly a withdrawal or a `hesitancy on `the part of the
people that are enrolled to open up, because they do not really know
who these people represent and where they may meet them again.
Mr. WRIGHT. It would be a lot easier for them to talk when they
know the others in the room have beeii confronted with the same prob-
lem that confronts them now.
Mr. BILLY. One identifies with the other and says, "Where did you
get caught? How did you get caught?
And by the second session you may find that they have become rather
close friends.
Mr. WRIGHT. But did you not tell one of our staff counsel a. story of
one fellow who came t.he first night `and was so impressed that the
second night he came and `brought a lot of his friends who he thought
needed it?
Mr. BILLY. They came in en masse and we had to go out and get some
extra chairs.
Mr. WRIGHT. He rounded up `all those that he thought ought to be
exposed to this.
Mr. BILLY. I thought we were getting invaded. And tha.t particular
individual came in with a rather hostile `attitude at the initial session,
and afterward he asked us `when he was departing if he could bring
these other people-because, actually, they were dropping him off any-
way, you know. When they left him for the first. session they blew `the
horn and they `all piled inside the car and said, "You go in." And he
did, a.nd then he brought them in to the next session.
In fact, we have h'ad people come `back to the sessions-we had one
particular boy that for three sessions was probably the most hostile
I h'ad encountered. About a month and a h'alf ago he showed up `at the
class and he asked if he could sit in on the class.
And I said, "Well, you are all finished."
And he said, "I know, but I am a student a.t San Antonio College
and I am required to present `a course, and I just t.hought that this
could be `my course. May I have some of the material and may I sit
in on this particular session?"
That is most gratifying.
Mr. MYERS. Have you evaluated the peer effect in the classroom, the
effect of interrelationship of members in the classrooms?
Mr. BILLY. You say evaluate them. In what respect, sir?
Mr. MYERS. Are there advantages to isolating some clients as opposed
to an attempt to provi'de classes based on peer equality? Do some indi-
viduals get more out of it as a result of being with others of the
same~
Mr. BILLY. I have not seen any isolation. We get various ethnic
groups. We get various age groups, and we `also get various academic
groups from zero education on up to master's degrees. We have had
PAGENO="0125"
121
people come through there with-in faet, a biologist, a `medical student
came through, the complete spectrum.
Mr. MYERS. When you offer these classes do you get `any requests for
confidential classes as opposed to group classes, individual classes?
Mr. BILLY. No, sir.
Mr. WRIGhT. I would imagine Mr. B'radshaw would h'ave a situa-
tion of that kind.
Mr. BRADSHAW. Yes. All our relationships are confidential and we
are not permitted to share them with `anyone unless the patient gives
a specific release.
Mr. MYERS. But in the classrooms where you are structured for-
what-20 or 30 members-do you find any significant number of indi-
viduals hanging afterward asking questions that they were not able
to ask in front of the rest of the group or giving any indication that
perhaps you should look at the possibility of selecting people out for
individual contact?
Mr. BILLY. I have seen this happen, and when they feel that they
have a point that they want to bring out-and they are a little bit
hesitant. They do not know the people well enough and they do not
know the instructor well enough to share, so they will stay around
and-I recall one particular female that stayed around and she identi-
fied in the third person constantly.
She refered to her friend, her friend, her friend who had a partic-
ular problem, and then when we finally broke it down to the fact that
it was she, she was willing to come back the next session and disclose
this to all the people, because she said: "I am afraid that they will
laugh at me, but I would like to talk about it."
And her problem was that she was a rather obese woman~
Mr. MYERS. I am sorry. I think in the interest of time-
Mr. WRIGHT. We really could stay all night and all day tomorrow.
Thank you very much for giving us the benefit of this. It has been
extremely beneficial.
We have one other witness-in some respects, the most important
of all-and we are grateful for your having stayed around this long,
Mr. Hawkins.
Mr. Thomas E. Hawkins, Director of the Department of Environ-
mental Impact and Social Sciences for the Southwest Research
Institute, and the evaluator of this San Antonio ASAP program.
You, too, Mr. Hawkins, have presented us with an excellent state-
ment, which, with your permission, we would like to make a part of
the record at this point.
Mr. HAWKINS. Yes, if you would, please.
[The statement referred to foflows:]
PAGENO="0126"
122
STATEMENT BEFORE TILE
House Public Works and Transportation Committee
Subcommittee on Investigation and Reviesv
San Antonio, Texas
August 8, 1975
Evaluation of the San Antonio Alcohol Safety Action Project
Thomas E. Hawkins
Ditectot
Department of Environmental Impact and Social Sciences
Southwest Research Institute. San Antonio. Texas
Mr. Chairman:
It is a pleasure to appear before you today to discuss San Antonio's Alcohol Safety Action Project.
Southwest Research Institute, a not-for-profit organization located in San Antonio, is responsible
for the evaluation of the project. I am the Principal Evaluator and have served in that capacity since
inception of the project. I have been involved with the evaluation of government programs for over
ten years, both as Chief, Plans Evaluation Division. Coast Guard Headquarters. and in my current
position. Based upon this experience. I have two points which I believe are pertinent to this hearing.
o The problem of Isow to alleviate the effects of the drunk driver is extremely complex and
it is deep-rooted. Primarily, this is caused by the number of power centers." each
independent of another, which must deal with the drunk driver, and the apathy generated
by years and years of drunk driving by a substantial portion of the public. Without
question, the San Antonio ASAP has focused attention on the magnitude and seriousness
of the problem, and has demonstrated that the only answer is the ASAP "systems
approach."
o More time and money-approximately 13% of the overall ASAP budget-have been spent
on evaluation than in any other program svith which I am familiar. While I am convinced
that all programs should be subjected to intensive evaluation. I am also well aware that
evaluation is virtually useless stnless it is integrated into the decision-making process. In
this regard. I am fortunate. The Project Director. the Contract Technical Manager. and I
have mutual respect for each other, and we function as a team. At no time during the
four years that we have been involved in the project has any major decision been made
without all of us discussing the matter at length.
The original objective of the San Antonio ASAP, "Through close coordination of all counter-
measure actions, to seek the most effcctit'e, practical and economical countermeasures to achieve a
substantial reduction in the number and severity of traffic accidents caused by drunk drivers, which
may be established as a permanent traffic safety program for San Antonio and Bexar County," has
never been changed. We felt that we must demonstrate effective, practical. and economical counter-
measures before they should be converted into on-going programs of the City and County, and
ultimately result in a closed-loop system adequate to all aspects of the problem. Our concept was to
plan, implement. evaluate. and replan on the basis of the results of the evaluation. Under this
approach. every countermeasure was altered during the last three years.
PAGENO="0127"
123
To assist the Project Manager in evolving an adequate closed-loop system, we developed and imple-
mented evalualion designs for each of the countermeasure activity areas-law enforcement, judicial,
rehabilitation, and public information and education-and for ultimate performance of the overall
program. During the first 1 8 months-the planning period and the first year of operation-our
primary emphasis was of necessity on data systems. Because of this emphasis, I considered the first
year's evaluation rather elementary. However, dsiring the past 24 months the development of
evaluation designs has been our primary thrust. We have determined what does, and what does not,
meet our objective. Our research designs fall into five basic categories:
o For monthly and quarterly reviews to determine the degree to which the "system" was
operating as planned, measurement has been made of actual performance and compared
against predetermined performance estimates. These rather simple measures (for example,
patrol man-hours per DWI arrest) have been most helpful in uncovering system malfunc-
tions almost on a real-time basis;
o For annual analyses of effectiveness and cost effectiveness, statistical analyses have been
made of one group against another comparison group, and of longitudinal trend analyses
of results during baseline and operational ASAP periods;
o For determination of public attitudes and overall project impact, Voluntary Roadside
Surveys and stratified, random sample Household Surveys were conducted annually;
o While it is not a formal evaluation design, the constant interaction between the Project
Director, myself, and the Countermeasure Leaders has been integral to our objective of
determining what is practical: and
o For those areas where our routine evaluation designs reveal problem areas, but no
answers, we have conducted special research experiments and analyses.
The results from the evaluation of the first three years are summarized in the attached document.
Full copies of the six analytic studies also have been made available to your staff.
Evaluation of the San Antonio ASAP has largely achieved the project's objective "to seek the most
effective, practical and economical" alcohol-related accident countermeasures. Only two major
questions remain unanswered:
o To what degree can enforcement, through its own patrolling activity, directly accomplish
a reduction in alcohol-related accidents?
o For what type of clients are the rehabilitation countermeasures effective in rehabilitating
drunk drivers?
The objective of the ASAP is now focused on answering these two questions. The research plan
which the San Antonio ASAP is implementing during the 2-year extension period will provide the
answers. This sophisticated research plan builds upon our findings from the initial ASAP period. In
enforcement, three different patrol strategies are being evaluated using accident rates and frequent
roadside surveys. The strategies are city-wide patrolling, expressway patrolling on Friday, Saturday,
and Sunday nights, and emphasis patrolling of two relatively small areas located in the north and
south sides of the city. A concurrent "fear of arrest" public information campaign is also being
PAGENO="0128"
124
.~ondueted. In rehabilitation, the effectiveness of various treatment programs is being evaluated
through random assi~ment of DWI clients to suitable rehabilitation or probationary programs.
in-depth follow-up interviews to measure improvement in their life style, and examination of their
DWI re-arrest and accident rates. The project, with the cooperation of the Texas Education Agency.
also has implemented special alcohol-drinking instruction in the driver education classes of a local
,..hool district. The knowledge gained will be evaluated by comparison with another district having
similar socio-economic characteristics.
The Iwo-year extension should provide sufficient time to develop definitive answers to the research
questions. However, I am less confident that it will provide enough time to substantially reduce
alcohol-related accidents in San Antonio. Based on annual roadside surveys throughout the city
during the initial years, and a more recent survey conducted on the expressways, I estimate that on
a typical Friday or Saturday night there are as many as 1 2.000 DWls on the streets of San Antonio.
In order to achieve a substantial impact on this problem. a long-term program is required with
omicerted effort by all agencies involved with the DWI control s\stem. and active support h the
icral p blic and community leaders.
PAGENO="0129"
125
TESTIMONY OP THOMAS E. HAWKINS, DIRECTOR, DEPARTMENT OP
ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT AND SOCIAL SCIENCES, SOUTHWEST
RESEARCH INSTITUTE, AND EVALUATOR, SAN ANTONIO ASAP,
ACCOMPANIED BY DAVID CANANN, STATISTICIAN
Mr. WRIGhT. We will let you proceed in such a way as you would
like and have a colloquy and we could utilize the few precious moments
remaining to the best possible advantage to get the maximum infor-
mation.
Mr. HAWKINS. Very good, sir.
The objective of the San Antonio alcohol safety action project is
rather basic, to seek the most effective, practical, and economical coun-
termeasures to achieve a substantial reduction in the number and
severity of traffic accidents caused by the drinking drivers.
Our approach has been to plan, implement, evaluate, and replan
on the basis of the results of the evaluation. Under this approach,
every countermeasure, every activity that ASAP has run, has been
altered in the last 3 years. We had no wisdom when we started.
ASAP, I think, has achieved a great deal and I do not want to
dwell on that because I think that was really adequately covered
today, sir. Witness after witness has covered the accomplishments,
so I guess it falls to me to give you some of the negative aspects.
ASAP did not achieve a significant reduction in alcohol-related ac-
cidents. Why? There are a number of reasons.
The project was overwhelmed by some external factors, increases
in licensed drivers, annexation, rainfall, no new roadway construc-
tion, economic prosperity, increases in the number of drivers who
drank-not excessively, but did drink-and the general movement
of youth away from hard drugs back toward alcohol. These things by
themselves, in my opinion, could well have overwhelmed everything
that ASAP did.
Second, when we started the project, we all assumed-and by
"we" I mean NHTSA, the city and the county when they accepted
the project, the project director, and the project evaluator when we
designed it, and I suppose the Congress also assumed the same thing,
that 3 years and $2.3 million was enough to have a significant impact.
We were all wrong. It just simply is not enough time.
The problem, as you phrased it, is very pervasive and overall its
solution is extremely complex, and 3 years were not enough. It j ust
simply was not enough time.
Now, what was the magnitude of the problem that we were try-
ing to come to? We have a very significant drunk driving problem in
the city of San Antonio. Our most factual and scientific information
comes from the voluntary roadside surveys which are conducted every
year at the same spot, the same day of the week. same general time of
the year, the same time of the night. Based on these, we find that
overall on a Friday or a Saturday night about 11 percent of the drivers
in San Antonio are DWI. That is the basis. I am the source of the
8,600 figure mentioned earlier in the day.
In May of this year I, for the first time, conducted roadside surveys
on the expressways. I have now increased the number to 12,000-just
any Friday or Saturday night, I think we have at least 12,000 drunk
drivers on the road.
PAGENO="0130"
126
Early in the evening it is about 5 percent; late in the evening, 19
percent. We have several areas in the city that if you are driving
there and you are not yourself DWI, almost assuredly either the driver
of the car in front of you or the driver of the car in back of you is
DWI.
It is absolutely incredible to go out on the roadside survey-and
there are just hundreds of cars passing by and every 5 or 6 minutes
you randomly go out and pick one, and when you are all done, 40
percent of the particular site has been DWTI.
Mr. WRIGHT. How many people in the course of these random sur-
veys have you stopped and interviewed?
Mr. HAWKINS. We have a sample design of 640 for the citywide
samples that we have done for four times, and we have a survey design
of 300 for the expressway.
Mr. WRIGHT. You have done 600 four times?
Mr. HAWKINS. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. So there is 2,400 and more-2,500.
Mr. HAWKINS. I have done about 2,700 or 2,800.
Mr. WRIGHT. In all?
Mr. HAWKINS. Yes, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Over this period of time. This many you have stopped
and individually invited in for an interview?
Mr. HAWKINS. Right.
Mr. WRIGHT. They are not required or compelled to do this, but
most of them do it, you tell me?
Mr. HAWKINS. It is very near 99 percent volunteer.
Mr. MYERS. If I remember-Mr. Chairman-
Mr. WRIGHT. Go ahead.
Mr. MYERS. A sample size of 600 randomly ~would effectively repre-
sent about 99 percent-about a half a million people, is that correct?
With 99 percent assurance factor?
How many people are we dealing with in the total population that
you are attempting to-
Mr. HAWKINS. We have about 440,000 licensed drivers.
Mr. WRIGHT. Let us identify the statistician.
Mr. CANANN. My name is David Canann, Southwest Research.
Mr. WRIGHT. Would you spell you last name?
Mr. `CANANN. C-a-n-a-n-n.
Mr. MYERS. For the population that ~sve are attempting to pull out
a representative sample, for a safety factor of 1 percent-is that what
you are aiming at-confidence level?
Mr. CANANN. Well, our survey is not designed to determine what
percentage of the drivers are drinking-that is really not our objec-
tive. Our objective is to determine whether there has been an increase
or a decrease in 1 year, and, so, we are not really trying to estimate
that percentage. That was not our objective.
Mr. WRIGHT. But it is an interesting byproduct of your investi-
gation.
Mr. CANANN. It is interesting, right. I believe normal samplings
like national surveys, they use-and I am not certain of this, but I
believe they maintain a sample of about 1,300 to 1,500 to have a con-
fidence of plus or minus 3 percent.
PAGENO="0131"
127
Mr. WRIGHT. The Harris polls and the Gallup poils and the State
polis in our State operate on a much smaller sample as `a percentage
of the whole than you have been operating.
Mr. CANANN. Well, the idea is that it is the sample size itself. It is
1,300 versus our 640. So I would say our level of uncertainty is on the
order of 6 or 7 percent of the value, 10 percent plus or minus less than
1. percent.
Mr. MYERS.. A 95 percent confidence level in each study. Now, did
the studies differ between themselves?
Mr. CANANN. Each study `was done `at the same sites, the same time
of night. We tried to keep it as identical as possible so that we could
identify changes.
The first year I think the over-all percent was about 12.8 percent.
That was before ASAP. The next 2 years it was down to 10.8 percent,
and the last year it is back up to 11.7 percent, something like that.
Those are n~t significant changes, but we did have `a slight reduction
those first 2 years, but it is not enough to be statistically significant.
To `be statistically significant, it would have had to have dropped from
about 12.8 percent to roughly maybe 6 percent.
Mr. HAWKINS. Now, the extension of the problem to the drinking
or drunk drivers who cause fatalities, in the `absence of some legisla-
tion requiring a BAC test for all drivers involved in fatal or serious
injury accidents, this is a difficult question to handle.
Mr. WRIGHT. Wh'at is a BAC test?
Mr. HAWKINS. Blood alcohol `con'centration test, the breathalyzer.
Mr. WRIGHT. OK.
Mr. HAWKINS. It could be a breathalyzer or in the case of `an au-
topsy, an actual blood specimen.
And I do, `by the way, sir, recommend this as needed legislation.
Legislation to determine the degree of alcohol in the blood of every
driver involved in a fatal accident or a serious injury accident. That
is the only way we are really going to find out what the real problem
is.
Mr. WRIGHT. You recommend this as national legislation, Mr.
Hawkins?
Mr. HAWKINS. It may have to be passed at the State level, sir, but,
yes, I would recommend it at least as a national goal.
In the absence of this kind of legislation, we tapped every data
source that we have to try and find out for 1973 and 1974 what was the
alcohol involvement of the 283 people who were killed in traffic acci-
dents, the alcohol involved in the drivers. DWI drivers caused 40
fatalities; that is, they had a BAC level above 0.10 percent known
tested; 16 other fatalities were caused by pedestrians with blood alco-
hol concentrations above 0.10; impaired drivers, that is, above 0.05 were
involved in 49 additional fatalities; impaired pedestrians in 4.
We believe that another 46 fatalities were probably alcohol related,
but there was simply not enough hard data for me to say so with abso-
lute certainty.
If I include all of these, alcohol-related fatalities were 55 percent of
the total, and if I exclude the pedestrians and include only drivers, 48
percent of the total people were killed in al'cohol-related accidents.
The question was asked earlier what kind of a risk are we running
with the drivers; do they drink near home? Do they drink a long
PAGENO="0132"
128
way from home? Of the drivers who were DWI in the most recent
expressway survey, about 30 percent were within 1 mile of the site that
I stopped them at~-that is where they were drinking; 18 percent
within 1 to 2 miles; ~7 percent, 3 to 5 miles; 21 percent. 6 to 10 miles;
3 percent over 10 miles.
Impaired drivers, 0.05 to 0.09, show much, much less within the 1
mile and over 31 percent have traveled over 10 miles in the expressway
system-31 percent, they drank over 10 miles away from where I
stopped them. That is 0.05 to 0.09, and I think there is enough scientific
evidence to say that they are a hazard. They may not be DWI, but they
are a hazard. They are traveling long distances, some of them.
We have never asked this question before in a citywide survey and
I think we will find a much different answer. It will be much closer
to home within the city, but on the expressway system today they are
going long distances.
The major question that remains unanswered in enforcement is:
What enforcement-certainly through its own patrolling activity,
what kind of a deterrent can it have? Or, phrased another way, if the
city of San Antonio were considering continuing this project on its
own and they asked: "How much enforcement do I need?" I cannot
answer the question. We have never gone in with enough enforcement
to find out.
We did an alternative force level study-by that I mean, we drew
some very tight boundaries around the roadside survey sites, and then
put in one unit or two units or four units or eight units-we did all of
these combinations-and I was looking for what we call the knee of
the curve. In other words, there should have been a point at which
we had saturated, and the patrol would change. The curve was a
straight line. We never did achieve saturation to the point where
we were getting all the drunk drivers.
Mr. WRIGHT. If you had eight patrol cars in one area there would
be more arrests-
Mr. HAWKINS. Yes, sir, there were more arrests. There were eight
times as many arrests as when we only had one car.
Mr. WRIGHT. But your point is that if you had eight. cars, there
would not be fewer arrests per car than if you had one?
Mr. HAWKINS. Right. I thought when we designed it that we would
find the knee of the curve, but we did not. I would have gone over it
again with 16, except that we did not happen to have 16 vehicles.
Mr. WRIGHT. You were trying to find out how many cars it would
take patrolling in a given area to apprehend all those apprehendible
so that the number per car would decline.
Mr. HAWKINS. Right. And then I could start. doing some extrapola.-
tions. I never found the knee.
Mr. MYERS. Have you ever randomly chosen cars and tried to spe-
cifically estimate which cars `had drunk drivers?
Mr. HAWKINS. No, sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. You would be able to find a saturation point `by con-
densing the size of the patroled area with eight cars.
Mr. HAWKINS. At the eight-unit level we were patrolling-the San
Antonio Police Department was patrolling at one unit. per square
mile. In order to cover the city of San Antonio. that. would require
252 units. I thought it was enough and it was not..
PAGENO="0133"
129
Mr. WRIGHT. One unit per square mile is just not enoug~h to
saturate.
Mr. HAWKINS. It was only one night; it was oniy one night. So it
was not a good experiment, but I thought it was going to find some
`indication of what the answer was.
Mr. WRIGHT. You do not have any way of comparing San Antonio
with a city of smaller size, I suppose, or another city of this approx-
imate size, because this is the only place you have conducted this kind
of a survey.
Mr. HAWKINS. IRight, sir. We tried three other saturation experi-
ments, or what we termed "saturation experiments," and they were
of relatively short duration. We did not have enough manpower to go
in, `and the results on that were inconclusive.
Now, what we have done is designed the experiment that Inspector
Fitch described. We have two experiments going; one is on the express-
way-we just divided the expressway into 10 sectors. We are now
patrolling 5 of those 10 and we are going to continue to patrol until
we create a reduction, and then we are going to shift to the other
5 and find out what the residual effect is, how long does it force people
off the expressway.
Now, we may simply be forcing them to other areas of town, and
we accept that. The same rationale as for the two evaluation areas
that Inspector Fitch mentioned, A and B, the one on the north side
of town and one on the south side of town. These are relatively small
areas. We feel we are going in with enough manpower to make a
significant reduction.
Mr. WRIGHT. The Chair observes that it is 6 o'clock. I wonder if it
would be possible for those of us on the committee within the next
10 days or 2 weeks, perhaps to submit additional questions to you
that you might be willing to provide us answers for-
Mr. HAWKINS. I would be happy to.
Mr. WRIGHT [continuing]. And submit them in writing. I am about
to finish with the hearing-
Mr. MYERS. If I might, do you know of any convenient tests of
coordination that is being developed to be placed in the hands of
potential drivers to test and evaluate their ability to function?
Mr. HAwKINS. I know that the Department of Transportation is
working on several, but to my knowledge I do not know of any that
are operational, sir.
Mr. MYERS. I had a suggestion during the break here from a Mr.
Pat Markham of Boston who earlier was here and left. He made what
I thought was a rather interesting and intriguing suggestion, that part
of the problem with DWI's is that they get off-or they get their
license suspended and they get an occupational license, and that really
does not solve the problem. He made the suggestion that possibly that
not only an occupational license but an occupational license plate
would identify the car as a car which has had this particular type of
problem to the police out on the highway and that a person who was
assigned an occupational license would only be able to drive a car with
an occupational license plate on it. What is your reaction to that?
Mr. HAwKINS. Well, I understood that this was considered in our
original program design and it w-as not approved because of the stigma
effects. It was considered that when you were convicted of DWI, you
PAGENO="0134"
130
would have an orange license plate, "I am a DWI," but how can your
wife drive such a thing?
That was the difficulty. They did consider it. and that kind of a.
ground rule was not within the options that. we had here. in San
Antonio.
Mr. MYERS. In your opinion, when you look at 30,000 deaths a year,
would the orange license place stigma not-
Mr. HAWKINS. In my opinion, we should have orange license plates,
yes, but that is a personal opinion.
Mr. WRIGHT. At least for the individual who is a repeated offender,
perhaps.
Mr. HAWKINS. Yes, sir. Something along those lines. I think we have
covered this subject with almost every witness and the last five, six,
seven have discussed the problem of the random assignment. I hap-
pen to support it, sir. I think we have got to find out what is effective.
Somebody asked me what was recidivism. Since we started, some of
the people have been tracked for 12 full quarters, 3 years; there
are people who have only been tracked for 1 quarter, but we have
in our system 14,348 people DWI's. We have had 1,294 recidivists. Is
that good? Is that bad? I do not know.
I have 27 different recidivism rates here, and I simply cannot make
any sense out of it.
We have tried to go back and create after-the-fact. comparison
groups. They were not very good.
Even if we had concluded that the AIDE school was marginal, the
comparison groups were not good enough, and we would have still
have had to say, we do not know.
Mr. Canann does it on a very scientific basis, on a man-month of
exposure. None of the treatments prove significantly better than their
comparison, so we simply do not know.
We looked at DWI recidivism and crash recidivism. We t.hink likely
these are negative aspects. ~Te think very likely that we may be missing
the boat-there are rather rare occurrences. Maybe we are trying to
measure the wrong thing.
NHTSA has developed a life activities interview which is more
measuring the positive changes in a man's life, and that. has been in-
troduced into the San Antonio program.
I think sometimes you might have gotten the impression from the
judges and so forth that we designed a system that had no flexibility.
This was not so. We respected Judge Spector's request that she just
simply could not assign people to a control group. That is quite ac-
ceptance to us. We simply do not include her in the evaluation. The
people that she sends to AIDE or ATP we do not include in the
evaluation.
We built in flexibility so that the judges would have the freedom of
choice. We recognize that it is their choice. Simply when they do not
go along with the recommendation of Mr. Flores, we exclude them
from the analysis.
There is one element of the program that I do iiot think we really
covered and that is public information and education. I will try and
answer your question about the BAC card. We distributed about 40,000
of those, but we had many other elements-pamphlets, brochures,
fliers-that also have that same kind of information on them.
PAGENO="0135"
131
I think we probably got to 25 to 30 percent of the people through
that kind of information, possibly more. I never measured that one
directly.
One of the questions that we have asked on household surveys and
in the roadside surveys is the number of drinks versus weight to be-
come DWI. Beginning in 1971, the base line year, about 25 percent of
the general public knew the correct answer. That has steadily gone
up each year. It is now 48 percent.
That is in fact one of the major elements of the San Antonio public
information and education campaign, to know your limit.
However, before we get too excited about, you know, how well we
have done, I think we have to realize that the general public is not
the drinking public. Where of the general public 48 percent knew,
those people who were driving or who say they do drink but had
negative BAC's, only 20 percent knew the correct answer. Of those
who drive and drink and were between .01 and .09-that is, they had
had something to drink but were not drunk-about 24 percent knew.
And, of course, the worst category was the drunk driver. Only 13 per-
cent knew.
P.1. & E., I think, is a great program for the general public, but we
just have not found one to get to the drunk driver, and I would like
to conclude that we cannot get to him with a P.1. & E. program. We
have got to arrest him, put him through the-
Mr. WRIGHT. P.1. & E., meaning public information and education?
Mr. HAWKINS. Public information and education. Put him through
the adjudication process and then put him through rehabilitation, and
then you have him for a long time. He is a captive.
After 3 years of sustained effort by the public information and
education specialist of the project's staff, talking at high schools, at
the school district level, the Texas education agency level, we have
gotten Northside Independent School District to agree to a pilot pro-
gram of putting in 3 hours of drinking and driving material into their
driver education course. And they have also indicated that if it is suc-
cessful, they would consider implementing that on a statewide basis.
It has taken us 3 years to get them to do the experiment. If it is
successful and we can get them to implement that statewide-someone
talked about the lower levels, and they do have what they call a K. to
12-a kindergarten through 12, 12th grade-educational program,
and that would be the next step, to see if we could introduce that.
It is late, so let me go to the final question: What kind of a program
and of what duration would be required in San Antonio in order to
actually achieve a reduction?
It seems to me that the program will have to be very long term, if
not permanent. With the kind of problem we have, it is simply not
going to be cured overnight; it is not going to be cured in this 2-year
continuation period.
Does that mean that the city or the county should ask the Federal
Government to continue funding? I, personally, do not feel so, if that
is appropriate.
If we can answer our two research questions, then, by and large, I
believe the Federal investment will have served its purpose.
What can we do? My personal opinion is that the major financial
burden should shift as rapidly as possible to the DWI who is the
problem. In other words, I am proposing a violator-financed system.
PAGENO="0136"
132
There are other options. YOU c~n have a tax-revenue-financed system,
whether it be the city or Federal-financed; you can also adopt the
point of view that you raised this morning of having a drinker-
financed system or some combination thereof of the three.
I am convinced that the city and the county can have quite au effec-
tive ASAP program, and my basis for saying that is another contract
I have with NHTSA for the application of ASAP results to State
and local programs. One of the elements of it is to look at the economics
of ASAP. There is a great deal of money that moves around in this
system. And based oii some preliminary work that we have done-
and I will be very happy to keep the subcommittee advised on the
contract as it progresses-I am convinced that with some. very modest
changes the program can be made self -sustaimng.
And that is all I have, if there are any questions~ sir.
Mr. WRIGHT. Well, we can still sit here and think of questions. and
there are some questions that were submitted by Mr. Levitas before
he left. We will submit these to you in writing, if we may.
Mr. HAWKINS. That will be fine.
Mr. WRIGHT. And permit us, if you will, to do the same, because we
expect, even after the hearing has gone to bed and been published, to
retain a continuing interest in the progress of your inquiry, and
to try to learn what we can from this experiment.
Mr. HAWKINS. I think everybody that is involved in this project
in .San Antonio is enthusiastic and hard working. and they very much
appreciate your coming down here, sir, and we will be most happy to do
anything we can to give you what advice we have.
Mr. WRIGHT. We certainly apreciate the excellent testimony we have
received today, and I believe it has been uniformly excellent.
We want to express the thanks of all our committee members to all of
the witnesses who have appeared today. We thank them for their can-
dor, for their intelligence, for the information they have shared with
us. You have been a great help to us.
I am certain that the information provided here. today will be of
value, not only to the Congress but to all the other are.as~ which may
be considering implementing some such program as we have been
undertaking here.
And while I hesitate to say that this hearing is adjourned, because
the inquiry is not adjourned-it remains very much alive-let me
simply call a halt to it at this particular stage with the expectation that
our subcommittee will continue its active interest in this vital field of
endeavor.
The subcommittee is adjourned at this point.
[Whereupon, at 6 :15 p.m., the subcommittee adjourned.]
0